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Flight Rising Discussion

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TOPIC | fiona and galore are trans icons
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[quote name="FallenEclipse" date="2020-01-24 08:26:07" ] [quote name="@itsThirteen" date="2020-01-24 06:55:56" ] Uh, where does it say Fiona is trans? [/quote] [Url=https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/frd/2812274/4#post_42031300]Right here![/url] [s]also y'all, calm down please,,[/s] [/quote] Oh, neat
FallenEclipse wrote on 2020-01-24 08:26:07:
@itsThirteen wrote on 2020-01-24 06:55:56:
Uh, where does it say Fiona is trans?

Right here!

also y'all, calm down please,,

Oh, neat
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I'm highkey confused by this thread. Headcannons are headcannons, and whatever they identify with, they are precious beans eitherway.

People here are saying that Fiona is trans (which is now confirmed) and noticed it is due to the antennas, which has as far as I know no proper lore related to their antenna numbers other than official site art, which could've been similar to Bogsneak fins and totally random.

Yet in the same thread try to deny that Galore is a male (wether he actually is or not is irrelevant at this point) despite in FR lore and art, only males have beards and in the Encyclopedia it states that it's the males who boast impressive beards.

It's both interesting and confusing at the same time.
I'm highkey confused by this thread. Headcannons are headcannons, and whatever they identify with, they are precious beans eitherway.

People here are saying that Fiona is trans (which is now confirmed) and noticed it is due to the antennas, which has as far as I know no proper lore related to their antenna numbers other than official site art, which could've been similar to Bogsneak fins and totally random.

Yet in the same thread try to deny that Galore is a male (wether he actually is or not is irrelevant at this point) despite in FR lore and art, only males have beards and in the Encyclopedia it states that it's the males who boast impressive beards.

It's both interesting and confusing at the same time.
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I don't know how to tell ya'll this but...having a beard doesn't mean a darn thing. I'm a woman and I have a beard.

And no, I don't take hormones.
I don't know how to tell ya'll this but...having a beard doesn't mean a darn thing. I'm a woman and I have a beard.

And no, I don't take hormones.
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[quote name="Ern" date="2020-01-24 07:06:20" ] Yikes, this thread is a bit scary. I think the issue is less about people's headcanons and more about people asserting them as fact. Saying "Galore IS trans" or "Galore IS cis" or whatever is obviously going to upset people on the opposite side, because that doesn't align with how they see it. Galore is whatever you want them to be, but that doesn't mean others will see him the same way. Using less assertive language might help ease tensions. [/quote] It is because Fiona is the first dragon staff have said IS something. (Scribbles was less obviously revealed) So they've decided that they are ok with confirming character traits like gender. The reasoning is if staff said Fiona is trans, but staff never said Galore was, then surely he isn't? The reason this is getting all sticky is now it isn't just headcannons - people will say you can headcannon anything but I think people would be getting angry if you headcannoned Fiona as a cis skydancer with an antennae defect. Before, everything has headcannon, but now we have ACTUAL canon that overrides headcannons. Now we know there's canon everyone wants to know the actual canon. And now that NPCs can have confirmed identity, people are going to want themselves represented - a trans male npc? Gay npcs? Ect. I've already seen people requesting the next npc be *thing*. Certainly not bad to have representation but everyone wants a share.
Ern wrote on 2020-01-24 07:06:20:
Yikes, this thread is a bit scary.

I think the issue is less about people's headcanons and more about people asserting them as fact. Saying "Galore IS trans" or "Galore IS cis" or whatever is obviously going to upset people on the opposite side, because that doesn't align with how they see it. Galore is whatever you want them to be, but that doesn't mean others will see him the same way. Using less assertive language might help ease tensions.

It is because Fiona is the first dragon staff have said IS something. (Scribbles was less obviously revealed) So they've decided that they are ok with confirming character traits like gender. The reasoning is if staff said Fiona is trans, but staff never said Galore was, then surely he isn't?

The reason this is getting all sticky is now it isn't just headcannons - people will say you can headcannon anything but I think people would be getting angry if you headcannoned Fiona as a cis skydancer with an antennae defect. Before, everything has headcannon, but now we have ACTUAL canon that overrides headcannons. Now we know there's canon everyone wants to know the actual canon.

And now that NPCs can have confirmed identity, people are going to want themselves represented - a trans male npc? Gay npcs? Ect. I've already seen people requesting the next npc be *thing*. Certainly not bad to have representation but everyone wants a share.

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[quote name="MurkyDepths" date="2020-01-24 09:13:41" ] It is because Fiona is the first dragon staff have said IS something. (Scribbles was less obviously revealed) [/quote] Huh? Undel said that Scribbles uses they/them pronouns and eschews gender, flat-out, in 2014, when people asked. I went back and checked before commenting in a different thread. Unless you mean less obvious like Fae don't have the same visual coding and nb is hard to get across when we've got two static poses to work off of, because yeah.
MurkyDepths wrote on 2020-01-24 09:13:41:
It is because Fiona is the first dragon staff have said IS something. (Scribbles was less obviously revealed)

Huh? Undel said that Scribbles uses they/them pronouns and eschews gender, flat-out, in 2014, when people asked. I went back and checked before commenting in a different thread. Unless you mean less obvious like Fae don't have the same visual coding and nb is hard to get across when we've got two static poses to work off of, because yeah.
@MurkyDepths

You bring up some really great points. Personally I have no problem at all with folks taking any character and making it what they want it to be in their head, as long as they don't force it on others. But, we've already seen people scolded by aequorin even for the Fiona head canon you mentioned. If taking a confirmed trans character and making them something else in your mind constitutes invalidating gender identity, then does taking a character who hasn't been confirmed to be trans (like Galore) and making them trans also constitute invalidation of gender identity?

It seems like the ideal situation would be for staff to clarify all the NPC genders. You're right then, of course, that folks who feel underrepresented in other areas would also seek representation but I don't think that clarifying sexuality is necessary in the case of Trading Post NPCs.
@MurkyDepths

You bring up some really great points. Personally I have no problem at all with folks taking any character and making it what they want it to be in their head, as long as they don't force it on others. But, we've already seen people scolded by aequorin even for the Fiona head canon you mentioned. If taking a confirmed trans character and making them something else in your mind constitutes invalidating gender identity, then does taking a character who hasn't been confirmed to be trans (like Galore) and making them trans also constitute invalidation of gender identity?

It seems like the ideal situation would be for staff to clarify all the NPC genders. You're right then, of course, that folks who feel underrepresented in other areas would also seek representation but I don't think that clarifying sexuality is necessary in the case of Trading Post NPCs.
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Here are some replies by Aequorin that people use as a basis for their trans Galore headcanons, for the people who are wondering: 1, 2

I personally headcanon Galore as non-binary, since it doesn't seem like he identifies as either male or female (I don't know why else staff would avoid stating his gender).

All that was confirmed was that he goes by he/him pronouns, and not using gender-neutral pronouns doesn't necessarily mean he isn't non-binary, as many nb people use he/him or she/her.
Here are some replies by Aequorin that people use as a basis for their trans Galore headcanons, for the people who are wondering: 1, 2

I personally headcanon Galore as non-binary, since it doesn't seem like he identifies as either male or female (I don't know why else staff would avoid stating his gender).

All that was confirmed was that he goes by he/him pronouns, and not using gender-neutral pronouns doesn't necessarily mean he isn't non-binary, as many nb people use he/him or she/her.
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[quote name="Ern" date="2020-01-24 09:32:08" ] But, we've already seen people scolded by aequorin even for the Fiona head canon you mentioned. If taking a confirmed trans character and making them something else in your mind constitutes invalidating gender identity, then does taking a character who hasn't been confirmed to be trans (like Galore) and making them trans also constitute invalidation of gender identity? [/quote] Galore has no confirmed gender. He's not cis until proven otherwise, he's not trans until proven otherwise, and he's not nb until proven otherwise. At the moment, his gender can't be "invalidated" because he lacks a canon one. His pronouns, however, are confirmed, so the only "invalidation" I could see is the wrong pronouns being used. Meanwhile, Fiona being headcanoned as something besides trans [i]is[/i] invalidating her gender identity, because she's canonically transgender. Technically, I think that antennae headcanon doesn't contradict her being trans, but the phrasing was odd. The two can coinside, and I wouldn't hold it against someone unless they tried to imply she was cisgender.
Ern wrote on 2020-01-24 09:32:08:
But, we've already seen people scolded by aequorin even for the Fiona head canon you mentioned. If taking a confirmed trans character and making them something else in your mind constitutes invalidating gender identity, then does taking a character who hasn't been confirmed to be trans (like Galore) and making them trans also constitute invalidation of gender identity?
Galore has no confirmed gender. He's not cis until proven otherwise, he's not trans until proven otherwise, and he's not nb until proven otherwise. At the moment, his gender can't be "invalidated" because he lacks a canon one. His pronouns, however, are confirmed, so the only "invalidation" I could see is the wrong pronouns being used.

Meanwhile, Fiona being headcanoned as something besides trans is invalidating her gender identity, because she's canonically transgender. Technically, I think that antennae headcanon doesn't contradict her being trans, but the phrasing was odd. The two can coinside, and I wouldn't hold it against someone unless they tried to imply she was cisgender.
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Thank you for clarifying that, I appreciate it!
@Drakessis

Thank you for clarifying that, I appreciate it!
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@Ern Np!! I'm glad it cleared stuff up!
@Ern Np!! I'm glad it cleared stuff up!
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