Suggestions

[quote name="Piscean" date="2021-10-13 22:40:36" ] @/Niceless i'm honestly not trying to do that, nor spread misinfo, but I don't see how repeating text posted on the site is that? i understand the bundle is called second-hand, but the item flavour text makes it quite clear where it comes from, with the head bandage saying it is "being used to cover a grievous wound." and the arms saying they "have been protecting some nasty cuts." [item=Bloody Head Bandage] [item=Bloody Arm Bandages] as for the red comment [url=https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/skin/3065334][b]i have to assume its coming from here.[/b][/url] [/quote] Staff have specified that what is written in text on site and what is drawn in art are completely different "categories" and that written text on the site should not be used for artistic references.

[quote name="@Piscean" date="2021-10-13 22:40:36" ] @/Niceless i'm honestly not trying to do that, nor spread misinfo, but I don't see how repeating text posted on the site is that? i understand the bundle is called second-hand, but the item flavour text makes it quite clear where it comes from, with the head bandage saying it is "being used to cover a grievous wound." and the arms saying they "have been protecting some nasty cuts." [item=Bloody Head Bandage] [item=Bloody Arm Bandages] as for the red comment [url=https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/skin/3065334][b]i have to assume its coming from here.[/b][/url] [/quote] None of us aren't trying to do it either but it's very very easy for it to be misinterpreted, and considering this is the only thread where we get to talk about anything even related to plague skins and their ruleset, we have to be very very very careful. One slip up can shut down all suggestions for a new skin guide [b]forever[/b]. I can't really find an explanation towards why staff hasn't changed these descriptions but I can't question that either. However staff has also said that literature gore and visual gore are two completely different things, hence why some nasty things are allowed in the lore but not in skins.

[quote name="panzerhaus" date="2021-10-13 07:35:04" ] ...official RoR skin, which to me seems like it'd be pretty unpleasant for the dragon in question. I assume these get by on the fact that there are elements to them keeping them from being too realistic--the bright green in the case of the former and in the case of the latter, well, there's no real-life disease or anything that really looks like that. [/quote] I am pretty sure "Engulfing Growths" skin is based off the shope papilloma virus, a virus which makes keratinous carcinomas grow on the body of cottentail rabbits. It's thought to be the cause of Jackalope myths because they can appear like horns. I wouldn't look up pictures if you're squeamish, they even make my skin itch a little.

I decided to do a quick look through the Game Database to see if I could find any examples of acceptable gore. Note that I didn't exhaustively go through each one, and so there could 100% be things I missed. [item= Nightmare] This one has shredded skin with presumably detail-absent muscle exposed underneath. Trends orange, but is definitely in the red camp. [item= Nochnyr] This one just has stitched skin, however, in between some of the gaps there's hints of red. [item= Spoiling Scorpio] Brings to mind the Plaguebringer and the rest of the Scarred Wasteland. Covered in red-orange pustules and that weird quasi-flesh substance. Also brings to mind one skin where something like a horn was protruding, can't remember which one however. [item= Swamphaunt Kelpie] My personal favorite from the list. It's most certainly sitting in blood, and whether that be its own or something else's isn't clear. Several skins that have been rejected are reminiscent of this, most notably the 'stinky armpit' one. Again, I cannot remember its name or its creator. [item= Blue Bill] Not alive, at least any more. However, it's very clearly a pool of blood sitting under that bill. Leave is up to the imagination what's beyond that border, but heavily implies it's nothing good. [item= Slimy Tusk] Not red blood, but the creature it came from wouldn't bleed red, seeing as it's a snail. Obviously not ideal for those wishing to have small amounts of red blood, however, it's accurate to the creature. [item= Spade Tail] Much like the Blue Bill above, it's no longer attached to a creature it once was. Possible blood spatters on the stone and has clearly been cut off. In terms of corpses, there's also the Reeba and Zeeba food items, which are bloodied with ribs sticking out of them. I didn't think to link them when I spotted them and it's getting late, so if I remember to tomorrow I might edit to show them as well. All in all, I think part of the problem is the lack of access to references like these. I spend a good half hour hunting these down, and that's unreasonable to ask of someone who just wants to make sure their blood splatters are okay on an accent. Hand in hand with that, some of these show that some skins that have been rejected are actually well within what the site itself shows. I also saw on a couple of occasions dripping pink liquids from very much alive familiars, bringing to mind the hambone skin as well as the glitch skin from previous years in this thread. There should be a better guide than just 'if you can't find it, don't draw it'. What is some people couldn't find any of these example I listed for one reason or another? Even just linking to these items as a guide would be far better than nothing. In addition, providing more examples can help add to the clarity of where the line is drawn. As it stands, the users cannot see it, and we are the ones who need it.

Full support, you can't tell me my dragon ripped out a tooth from a beastclan to take it to Swipp and not let players draw minor bloody cuts and some infected bruises. [item=Warbeast Tusk] Plus, I just think if the site is already T rated, why not?

[quote name="IchiHanabi" date="2021-10-14 01:44:36" ] [item= Blue Bill] Not alive, at least any more. However, it's very clearly a pool of blood sitting under that bill. Leave is up to the imagination what's beyond that border, but heavily implies it's nothing good. [/quote] Actually, I think that that item is sitting on red cloth? It absolutely reads as blood, but zooming it in on mobile it has some odd folds for a fluid. Edit: [item=sawbeak bill] this is an alternative item, and it’s much clearer that this probably isn’t blood when you compare it to this one. I noted this from Churrel, I didn’t see their post originally

A couple of things I have been thinking of while this has been going on:

I wonder if there were a staff change at some point in the past? I do know some people no longer work for Stormlight, but there were gorier skins (and plague itself) allowed at the beginning of the site's life, but then it changed, so I wonder if something changed behind the scenes that we are unaware of. (not really wanting to open up a discussion, unless through PM, just a thought I had about why things might have 'changed')

The other, the majority of the items mentioned don't depict 'active' suffering. They depict the aftermath of suffering (such as the pieces of enemies), but those creatures are not suffering *now*.

The nightmare on the previous page is apparently not a corporeal creature *will only make itself known in dreams*, so technically it isn't 'suffering', the Nochnyr is apparently an amalgamation of creatures, and not a truly 'living' creature *a haphazard union of spare parts* so isn't technically suffering.

The plague familiar is based off of the plague eyes, and again is one of the issues people have with pustules being allowed but not minor cuts.

The kelpie it is really hard to tell whether that IS blood (I have a hard time telling whether the liquid is red, or if it is just from the red stuff near it that makes me think the stuff is red) and even if it is, again, it is most likely not the kelpies (as the kelpie doesn't look like it has a wound), which again means aftermath of suffering and not active.

Alternatively, skins are always going to go on 'live' dragons, which means that a skin that shows a cut will always show *active* suffering, instead of just the after math of suffering.

I think that may be where the line is. The majority of items (not saying that on a site with thousands of items there won't be exceptions) don't depict *active* suffering, but rather after math of it, but sadly with the way skins work, any skin showing wounds or blood will always go on a 'live' dragon implying active suffering.

I don't know whether or not these have anything to do with the rules or not, but just some things I have thought about lately