Undo Today's Coliseum Enemy Buffs | Suggestions

[quote name="DragonGirl218" date="2014-08-25 15:02:01"]Tell me...was it easy to get through the Arena at level 17? The Mire at level 23? [/quote] I've trained 61 dragons to level 25 now, and yeah, it was. I have never had a problem with leveling up in any venue. I don't mind if people don't support this suggestion, but I [i]do[/i] want to point out that making enemies tankier doesn't make the game more difficult; it just makes it more tedious. Having to do two scratches plus an elim instead of one scratch and an elim wouldn't kill my dragons, but it would make it take longer to kill enemies. However, from what Undel has been saying and what Culex is telling me after running some numbers, none of the changes have made it so that we can kill [i]fewer[/i] enemies than we could before, [i]as long as we make sure to have augment stones equipped[/i]. We're gonna need the stones now to level as quickly as we did before (plus take out a few more enemies than before). And I guess I just don't see the point of that. It's like: Previously, with unbuffed enemies and without stones: Leveling was pretty easy. Now, with buffed enemies and with stones: Leveling is pretty easy. Now, with buffed enemies and without stones: Leveling is hard. Those of us who equip, say, three berserkers now DO get an advantage, as we should. We can one-hit eliminate all of the enemies we could before, plus a few more. We're actually not hurt at all by this. It's the people who don't equip any stones who suffer -- they can kill fewer enemies than they could before. Is that a big deal? No, not really; stones aren't that expensive. I just don't see the point of raising enemy stats if it's only going to punish people who can't/don't equip stones, and not help or hurt anyone who does equip stones. All that does is make stones a necessity; it doesn't change gameplay much. (One thing I am keeping in mind, though, is that as of right now, only defense and vitality were touched. If the enemies see a rise in quickness, that will make the coliseum much more difficult because we'll get fewer turns. I don't know if those changes are on the books or not.)

Cranberry

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August 25, 2014 18:38:27

DragonGirl218 wrote on 2014-08-25 15:02:01:

Tell me...was it easy to get through the Arena at level 17? The Mire at level 23?

I've trained 61 dragons to level 25 now, and yeah, it was. I have never had a problem with leveling up in any venue.

I don't mind if people don't support this suggestion, but I do want to point out that making enemies tankier doesn't make the game more difficult; it just makes it more tedious. Having to do two scratches plus an elim instead of one scratch and an elim wouldn't kill my dragons, but it would make it take longer to kill enemies.

However, from what Undel has been saying and what Culex is telling me after running some numbers, none of the changes have made it so that we can kill fewer enemies than we could before, as long as we make sure to have augment stones equipped. We're gonna need the stones now to level as quickly as we did before (plus take out a few more enemies than before). And I guess I just don't see the point of that. It's like:

Previously, with unbuffed enemies and without stones: Leveling was pretty easy.
Now, with buffed enemies and with stones: Leveling is pretty easy.
Now, with buffed enemies and without stones: Leveling is hard.

Those of us who equip, say, three berserkers now DO get an advantage, as we should. We can one-hit eliminate all of the enemies we could before, plus a few more. We're actually not hurt at all by this. It's the people who don't equip any stones who suffer -- they can kill fewer enemies than they could before.

Is that a big deal? No, not really; stones aren't that expensive. I just don't see the point of raising enemy stats if it's only going to punish people who can't/don't equip stones, and not help or hurt anyone who does equip stones. All that does is make stones a necessity; it doesn't change gameplay much.

(One thing I am keeping in mind, though, is that as of right now, only defense and vitality were touched. If the enemies see a rise in quickness, that will make the coliseum much more difficult because we'll get fewer turns. I don't know if those changes are on the books or not.)

Last edited on Aug 25, 2014 18:39:57 by Cranberry

Now that we have the explanation that the enemies were buffed because they had un-allocated stat points earlier, and that the enemy buffs are still smaller than the effect from working augment stones, I suppose I'm all right with the enemy buffs. [i]However[/i]... [quote name="sunreon" date="2014-08-24 16:09:34"][quote name="Undel" date="2014-08-24 15:59:48"] [quote name="Culex" date="2014-08-24 15:33:05"]While I honestly don't mind the buffing (it doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things as far as we know so far), I really dislike it being hidden & silent.[/quote] It would have been noted in our next update changelog. We want to be up-front with any changes we make! [/quote] I'm sorry to seem so cranky but [b]after the fact is [i]not[/i] up-front. [i]Up-front[/i] is up-front.[/b] When it happens or even before it happens is up-front. That is literally what up-front means. Please understand that an afterthought announcement after players are already freaking out about changes [i]does not help anyone.[/i][/quote] THIS, SO HARD. Please just [i]announce things before or when they're added, on the FR front page[/i]. I understand that you sometimes want people to discover fun things on their own, but the difference between fun discoveries and unpleasant/confusing ones should be pretty obvious.

nika

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August 25, 2014 18:54:35

Now that we have the explanation that the enemies were buffed because they had un-allocated stat points earlier, and that the enemy buffs are still smaller than the effect from working augment stones, I suppose I'm all right with the enemy buffs. However...

sunreon wrote on 2014-08-24 16:09:34:

Undel wrote on 2014-08-24 15:59:48:

Culex wrote on 2014-08-24 15:33:05:

While I honestly don't mind the buffing (it doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things as far as we know so far), I really dislike it being hidden & silent.

It would have been noted in our next update changelog. We want to be up-front with any changes we make!

I'm sorry to seem so cranky but after the fact is not up-front. Up-front is up-front.

When it happens or even before it happens is up-front. That is literally what up-front means.

Please understand that an afterthought announcement after players are already freaking out about changes does not help anyone.

THIS, SO HARD. Please just announce things before or when they're added, on the FR front page. I understand that you sometimes want people to discover fun things on their own, but the difference between fun discoveries and unpleasant/confusing ones should be pretty obvious.

[quote name="nika" date="2014-08-25 18:54:35"]Now that we have the explanation that the enemies were buffed because they had un-allocated stat points earlier, and that the enemy buffs are still smaller than the effect from working augment stones, I suppose I'm all right with the enemy buffs. [i]However[/i]... [quote name="sunreon" date="2014-08-24 16:09:34"][quote name="Undel" date="2014-08-24 15:59:48"] [quote name="Culex" date="2014-08-24 15:33:05"]While I honestly don't mind the buffing (it doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things as far as we know so far), I really dislike it being hidden & silent.[/quote] It would have been noted in our next update changelog. We want to be up-front with any changes we make! [/quote] I'm sorry to seem so cranky but [b]after the fact is [i]not[/i] up-front. [i]Up-front[/i] is up-front.[/b] When it happens or even before it happens is up-front. That is literally what up-front means. Please understand that an afterthought announcement after players are already freaking out about changes [i]does not help anyone.[/i][/quote] THIS, SO HARD. Please just [i]announce things before or when they're added, on the FR front page[/i]. I understand that you sometimes want people to discover fun things on their own, but the difference between fun discoveries and unpleasant/confusing ones should be pretty obvious.[/quote] Agreed, so agreed. I don't -care- about the news piling up and waiting a week or more for a mega post of important changes. Tell everyone the important changes as, if not before, they happen. So what if the front page moves quickly? FR should have a news archive anyway. Users shouldn't have to hunt through every single forum thread or go offsite to find out what's happening on FR.

gemajgall

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August 25, 2014 19:04:09

nika wrote on 2014-08-25 18:54:35:

Now that we have the explanation that the enemies were buffed because they had un-allocated stat points earlier, and that the enemy buffs are still smaller than the effect from working augment stones, I suppose I'm all right with the enemy buffs. However...

sunreon wrote on 2014-08-24 16:09:34:

Undel wrote on 2014-08-24 15:59:48:

Culex wrote on 2014-08-24 15:33:05:

While I honestly don't mind the buffing (it doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things as far as we know so far), I really dislike it being hidden & silent.

It would have been noted in our next update changelog. We want to be up-front with any changes we make!

I'm sorry to seem so cranky but after the fact is not up-front. Up-front is up-front.

When it happens or even before it happens is up-front. That is literally what up-front means.

Please understand that an afterthought announcement after players are already freaking out about changes does not help anyone.

THIS, SO HARD. Please just announce things before or when they're added, on the FR front page. I understand that you sometimes want people to discover fun things on their own, but the difference between fun discoveries and unpleasant/confusing ones should be pretty obvious.

Agreed, so agreed. I don't -care- about the news piling up and waiting a week or more for a mega post of important changes. Tell everyone the important changes as, if not before, they happen. So what if the front page moves quickly? FR should have a news archive anyway. Users shouldn't have to hunt through every single forum thread or go offsite to find out what's happening on FR.

Pings are disabled.

If writers are supposed to "show not tell," why are we called "storytellers" and not "storyshow-ers"?

Support. :c I was looking forward to the coliseum being less tedious with the augment stones, but if it's gonna be just the same, why bother? It's already too much of a grindfest for me to want to spend a lot of time on it.

Crowbar

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August 25, 2014 19:23:16

Support. :c I was looking forward to the coliseum being less tedious with the augment stones, but if it's gonna be just the same, why bother? It's already too much of a grindfest for me to want to spend a lot of time on it.

Last edited on Aug 25, 2014 19:23:55 by Crowbar

[quote name="gemajgall" date="2014-08-25 19:04:09"][quote name="nika" date="2014-08-25 18:54:35"]Now that we have the explanation that the enemies were buffed because they had un-allocated stat points earlier, and that the enemy buffs are still smaller than the effect from working augment stones, I suppose I'm all right with the enemy buffs. [i]However[/i]... [quote name="sunreon" date="2014-08-24 16:09:34"][quote name="Undel" date="2014-08-24 15:59:48"] [quote name="Culex" date="2014-08-24 15:33:05"]While I honestly don't mind the buffing (it doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things as far as we know so far), I really dislike it being hidden & silent.[/quote] It would have been noted in our next update changelog. We want to be up-front with any changes we make! [/quote] I'm sorry to seem so cranky but [b]after the fact is [i]not[/i] up-front. [i]Up-front[/i] is up-front.[/b] When it happens or even before it happens is up-front. That is literally what up-front means. Please understand that an afterthought announcement after players are already freaking out about changes [i]does not help anyone.[/i][/quote] THIS, SO HARD. Please just [i]announce things before or when they're added, on the FR front page[/i]. I understand that you sometimes want people to discover fun things on their own, but the difference between fun discoveries and unpleasant/confusing ones should be pretty obvious.[/quote] Agreed, so agreed. I don't -care- about the news piling up and waiting a week or more for a mega post of important changes. Tell everyone the important changes as, if not before, they happen. So what if the front page moves quickly? FR should have a news archive anyway. Users shouldn't have to hunt through every single forum thread or go offsite to find out what's happening on FR.[/quote] Agreed with what's stated above me. However, no support. I understand that it's tedious but like other aspects of the game where have you seen a battle arena where you aren't going to need stat boosters in the higher levels? Berserk wasn't designed to make going through Kelp a breeze, rather help. It wasn't working so the enemies matched this. Now (tentatively speaking) they work, some enemies reflect this. Even without tincture I can spend some time getting a dragon to lvl 7. And I learned late in point allocating where my focus should've been, so my healer isn't really all that great and neither is my damage dealer.

ellobomalo

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August 25, 2014 19:33:34

gemajgall wrote on 2014-08-25 19:04:09:

nika wrote on 2014-08-25 18:54:35:

Now that we have the explanation that the enemies were buffed because they had un-allocated stat points earlier, and that the enemy buffs are still smaller than the effect from working augment stones, I suppose I'm all right with the enemy buffs. However...

sunreon wrote on 2014-08-24 16:09:34:

Undel wrote on 2014-08-24 15:59:48:

Culex wrote on 2014-08-24 15:33:05:

While I honestly don't mind the buffing (it doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things as far as we know so far), I really dislike it being hidden & silent.

It would have been noted in our next update changelog. We want to be up-front with any changes we make!

I'm sorry to seem so cranky but after the fact is not up-front. Up-front is up-front.

When it happens or even before it happens is up-front. That is literally what up-front means.

Please understand that an afterthought announcement after players are already freaking out about changes does not help anyone.

THIS, SO HARD. Please just announce things before or when they're added, on the FR front page. I understand that you sometimes want people to discover fun things on their own, but the difference between fun discoveries and unpleasant/confusing ones should be pretty obvious.

Agreed, so agreed. I don't -care- about the news piling up and waiting a week or more for a mega post of important changes. Tell everyone the important changes as, if not before, they happen. So what if the front page moves quickly? FR should have a news archive anyway. Users shouldn't have to hunt through every single forum thread or go offsite to find out what's happening on FR.

Agreed with what's stated above me.

However, no support. I understand that it's tedious but like other aspects of the game where have you seen a battle arena where you aren't going to need stat boosters in the higher levels? Berserk wasn't designed to make going through Kelp a breeze, rather help. It wasn't working so the enemies matched this. Now (tentatively speaking) they work, some enemies reflect this. Even without tincture I can spend some time getting a dragon to lvl 7. And I learned late in point allocating where my focus should've been, so my healer isn't really all that great and neither is my damage dealer.

Support!

LottieLurker

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August 25, 2014 21:00:48

Support!

maybe a compromise could be proposed to where
the buff happens /but/ it is cut in half.
make it to were its on par with a dragon with one high level augment stone and if anymore augments are equipped as its a bonus (otherwise what is the point of having stats per level with augment boosters if they dont actually feel boosted more than say a while creature)

Tauros

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August 25, 2014 22:05:24

maybe a compromise could be proposed to where
the buff happens /but/ it is cut in half.
make it to were its on par with a dragon with one high level augment stone and if anymore augments are equipped as its a bonus (otherwise what is the point of having stats per level with augment boosters if they dont actually feel boosted more than say a while creature)

- wish i could remember who did this

Support.

On a side note, could we make this a poll?

Cutiepaws

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August 26, 2014 01:43:05

Support.

On a side note, could we make this a poll?

This just in: I may have to not support my own suggestion, haha. I'm training up a new team right now and with their berserkers equipped, they are slaughtering unbuffed Mire enemies at only level 21. That does seem too easy. Will need to do another team once enemies are re-buffed and see.

Cranberry

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August 26, 2014 02:14:16

This just in: I may have to not support my own suggestion, haha. I'm training up a new team right now and with their berserkers equipped, they are slaughtering unbuffed Mire enemies at only level 21. That does seem too easy. Will need to do another team once enemies are re-buffed and see.

Support

Also considering it took wondering into the suggestions forum for me to even hear about this happening is pretty enraging. A similar thing happened when the stones were fixed, I needed to hear it from other players. I don't like not knowing about these major changes, especially if it happens on Monday and you don't update the news until Sunday.

We should have heard about it as a footnote in the Flameforgers news update, not this upcoming update. That is too late. At the very least have a sticky at the top of bug report forum for "fixed issues" which gets updated when these things actually happen.

EclipseDragon

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August 26, 2014 08:18:17

Support

Also considering it took wondering into the suggestions forum for me to even hear about this happening is pretty enraging. A similar thing happened when the stones were fixed, I needed to hear it from other players. I don't like not knowing about these major changes, especially if it happens on Monday and you don't update the news until Sunday.

We should have heard about it as a footnote in the Flameforgers news update, not this upcoming update. That is too late. At the very least have a sticky at the top of bug report forum for "fixed issues" which gets updated when these things actually happen.

Last edited on Aug 26, 2014 08:19:05 by EclipseDragon