Suggestions

[quote name="RedWillia" date="2024-04-18 02:43:59" ] snip If you deleted all Snappers, arguably the least popular modern breed, a lot of people would notice and be unhappy as they fill a niche in "chonk with a smooth hide that can be dressed up". If you deleted all Aberrations, an obvious mold-breaking ancient, also a lot of people would notice and be unhappy as they fill a niche in "two heads are better than one at the cost of apparel". Controversial opinion incoming - but if you deleted Gaolers, would the same number of people be unhappy when an Obelisk or a Tundra with antlers apparel can fill in that roughly "fluffye" niche? [/quote] [center]I mean.. Personally I'd be unhappy if Gaolers suddenly disappeared from site. A couple of my favorite dragons are gaos :T Just because one breed is more popular, doesn't mean that others won't miss one that gets theoretically yeeted from existence. ---------------------------- Anyways, I've been happy with the ancients so far. I actually really like Dusthides, but I think a lot of it is just because I like the simpler design. (there's something about them.. I can't pinpoint it exactly) It takes a lot for me to truly dislike something. (And just to clarify, it's ok to not like something! I'm just stating I like them.. Not trying to change anyones mind.) HOWEVER I'd love to see more mold-breaking ancients :) I think it'd be cool to have wyrms, more wyverns, Asian-esque wingless dragons, etc. Heck, as much as I don't really care for bug looking dragons, I think it would be cool to have like.. A mantis inspired dragon or something.

support!

i like the dusthides, genuinely. but i really was hopeful for one that did something genuinely unique with the secondary slot; if they had a shell in place of wings, they'd absolutely be perfect in my eyes

i love funky! i love weird! aberrations are probably my favorite ancient, with auraboas being a close runner up! i want them to push the mold and lean into the potential of ancients breaking the rules! i know that that wasn't a promise with them, but i have to agree with the sentiment of, well... what's the point if they don't?

yes, we have a lot of ancients that break the mold, but in ways that are really... too subtle for me. i didn't actually realize aethers had 6 limbs for FAR too long until my fiance pointed it out to me, and i learned in this thread that veilspuns have 4 wings

and if they're not weird, i want tertiaries that knock it out of the park; dusthides got a pretty big w on terts so far, but they're still limited. and with how much of a blank slate they are, i'd LOVE to see that canvas used for more

at the end of the day, i just want them to take their time with ancients. i was expecting once a year, maybe once every two years; not 2-3 a year!

make them feel and look special in comparison to a modern

[quote][img]https://i.imgur.com/mhvXCYq.png[/img][/quote] Wait... Those are separate wings? I never noticed... I thought they were just segmented. Speaking of wings... [quote]Something with a lot of wings[/quote] Now I wish we could get a seraph-like Light ancient.

I agree. The Dusthides have weird hands and feet but tbh they could (creatively) still wear rings, gloves, ect, so I really don't see why they're ancients. I'm glad we have them, but they still adhere to the normal 2 arm, 2 leg, 1 head, two wings, 1 tail structure. It could be cool if maybe some day they were made to be moderns(with little to no change to their current design) but that's prob not gonna happen.

Same could be argued for Sandsurges, Veilspun, and Gaolers who have weird wings but otherwise follow the modern body structure and I imagine all apparel could be made to work on them.

I definitely want weirder ancient dragons. There are so many possibilities like wyrms, drakes, dracoliches, wyverns, eastern/asiian inspired dragons (Lung dragon), salamanders, Lindwyrms, Hydras, Kirin, Guivre, leviathans, sea orcs, fae, and that's really not even scratching the surface of the fantasy and real life creature inspirations that can lead to dragons

"Breaking the mold" is simply a bonus that Ancients might be designed with, made possible because they don't wear apparel. It is not something promised, nor is it the reason for Ancient dragons as a feature.

"What's the point" if not to break the mold? More playable dragons are released into the game in a reasonable timeframe. That's it.

[quote name="Zenzic" date="2024-05-22 12:16:09" ] "Breaking the mold" is simply a bonus that Ancients might be designed with, made possible because they don't wear apparel. It is not something promised, nor is it the reason for Ancient dragons as a feature. "What's the point" if not to break the mold? More playable dragons are released into the game in a reasonable timeframe. That's it. [/quote] This is the mold: the “[url=https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/ann/2666061#post_2666061]one head, four legs, two wings, one tail[/url]” template that exists [i]because[/i] they "need to wear apparel." In other words, the dragons that follow this template are [i]by literal definition[/i] Modern dragons... except that they are barred from wearing apparel. There's no benefit to them otherwise. Even if it's not promised, it absolutely should be. Otherwise, Ancients are just a blatantly inferior product with no upsides or points of interest no matter how much more quickly they're released.

[quote name="Almedha" date="2024-05-22 12:22:40" ] Even if it's not promised, it absolutely should be. Otherwise, [b]Ancients are just a blatantly inferior product with no upsides or points of interest no matter how much more quickly they're released.[/b] [/quote] Ancients having little value without modern deviation? I can't agree or disagree because that is an opinion, a manner of high subjectivity. I personally don't vibe as much with the Ancient designs that go further outside the template, so I like that Ancient design wackiness is not a rule or a promise. I also personally feel that Ancients are an inferior product to moderns [i]regardless of their design[/i], but there are plenty of other users who feel the opposite and neither opinion is objectively wrong.

[quote name="Zenzic" date="2024-05-22 14:19:59" ] [quote name="Almedha" date="2024-05-22 12:22:40" ] Even if it's not promised, it absolutely should be. Otherwise, [b]Ancients are just a blatantly inferior product with no upsides or points of interest no matter how much more quickly they're released.[/b] [/quote] Ancients having little value without modern deviation? I can't agree or disagree because that is an opinion, a manner of high subjectivity. I personally don't vibe as much with the Ancient designs that go further outside the template, so I like that Ancient design wackiness is not a rule or a promise. I also personally feel that Ancients are an inferior product to moderns [i]regardless of their design[/i], but there are plenty of other users who feel the opposite and neither opinion is objectively wrong. [/quote] I don't think it is subjective to say that a Modern dragon (which, by the original definition, Dusthides are) that cannot wear apparel is inferior to a Modern dragon that can. They have [i]no added value[/i]. People who do not like apparel can have Modern dragons that don't wear apparel - these people aren't in any way being overlooked by keeping Ancients to a non-Modern design. They have twenty-four dragon breeds they can use without apparel. The people who like the Modern design now have nineteen dragons that fit with what they like. The only people that are being overlooked are the people who wanted something else - potentially in exchange for the ability to wear apparel, though not necessarily. These people only have five dragons they "vibe with."

[quote name="Almedha" date="2024-05-22 17:53:23" ] [quote name="Zenzic" date="2024-05-22 14:19:59" ] [quote name="Almedha" date="2024-05-22 12:22:40" ] Even if it's not promised, it absolutely should be. Otherwise, [b]Ancients are just a blatantly inferior product with no upsides or points of interest no matter how much more quickly they're released.[/b] [/quote] Ancients having little value without modern deviation? I can't agree or disagree because that is an opinion, a manner of high subjectivity. I personally don't vibe as much with the Ancient designs that go further outside the template, so I like that Ancient design wackiness is not a rule or a promise. I also personally feel that Ancients are an inferior product to moderns [i]regardless of their design[/i], but there are plenty of other users who feel the opposite and neither opinion is objectively wrong. [/quote] I don't think it is subjective to say that a Modern dragon (which, by the original definition, Dusthides are) that cannot wear apparel is inferior to a Modern dragon that can. They have [i]no added value[/i].[/quote] Yes, that statement is arguably not subjective. However, it's also inaccurate to this situation. In the case of Ancients that do not break the Modern dragon "limb" mold, you (general You) instead need to pose this question instead: Is a Modern dragon that cannot wear apparel but comes with a larger variety of [b]visibly line-breaking tertiary genes[/b] inferior to a Modern dragon that can wear apparel but whose genes cannot extensively line-break. It's the line-breaking genes that are intended as the feature trade-off for Ancients, not the "mold-breaking". I personally feel that line-breaking tert genes, in addition to the faster turn-around times, are a perfectly serviceable trade-off for a dragon breed regardless of whether it breaks the "2 arms/legs/wings" mold or not. If it does, that's just icing.

[quote name="Twizz" date="2024-05-22 19:11:51" ] (snip) It's the line-breaking genes that are intended as the feature trade-off for Ancients, not the "mold-breaking". I personally feel that line-breaking tert genes, in addition to the faster turn-around times, are a perfectly serviceable trade-off for a dragon breed regardless of whether it breaks the "2 arms/legs/wings" mold or not. If it does, that's just icing. [/quote] Yes, as Twizz said; the Ancients trade apparel functionality for [i]significantly faster development time and their special line-breaking genes[/i]. It is not a situation of Ancient dragons just being less functional with zero compromises. Moderns have something Ancients don't, and that's apparel. Ancients have something Moderns don't, and that's line-breaking genes. How each user personally values what was gained or lost in this "trade" is entirely subjective.