Announcements & News

i am thankful for the change, but at the same time i am a bit upset... who decided that only those who have reached 60 or more are the ones who get the automatic expansions due to their previous payments? i just upgraded a day ago to the 55 range... it takes me forever to expand because i dont have time to grind in the coliseum. This is awesome for people who have the time to spend getting the treasure for the lair expansions, but for me it just means more work that i dont have time for to get my treasures worth back.

i understand that in real world if gas prices change an hour after you pump you dont get your money back, but to continue with this scenario it isnt fair that you gave a semi truck more gas because they pumped an hour ago but spent more.

Yes! Off to the AH.... :)

This is an update answered by the Gods and Goddesses themselves!

@Xhaztol [quote name="Xhaztol" date="2013-11-12 02:32:55"][quote name="jastoz" date="2013-11-12 02:11:41"]While adjustments being made only 60 and up seem arbitrary, they're not entirely. Those at 99 deserve to go up to 125, the only question is how far to take that back. Sure, at 55 in the old system you could've paid up to 65 in the new system, but that amount still isn't lost. [b]The different has simply been applied forward.[/b][/quote] This was our main philosophy in going forward with these changes. We opted to not provide treasure reimbursement for this update, as doing so would put millions, if not billions of treasure into the economy (risking inflation) for users with lairs below 60+, which may not have been used by everyone on lair expansions. This creates a [i]somewhat [/i]unfair deal for those with larger lairs, as their adjustments only came in the form of more slots, and not actual currency. Users with lower level lairs may not be receiving tangible 'refunds' via this change, but they are receiving a much sweeter deal on lair expansions going forward, keeping the benefits of the lair adjustments solely within the lair expansion system, and not creating a huge (potentially risky) stimulus. I do not disagree that this may feel like a slight, but would like everyone to know that it most definitely was [i]not [/i]meant as one, and was the most balanced way that we could devise to move forward with the change. We will, of course, keep our eyes peeled on this thread for your feedback, and appreciate every bit of it. :)[/quote] Okay. I get this. I do. And I agree that pumping millions or billions of treasure into the game could be a disaster. But I do [i]not[/i] agree that ignoring a good chunk of your dedicated playerbase is the solution. I have 55 lair spaces. Under the new system, I spent 175k more than I needed to, and got nothing in return. I feel very, very jipped, and I feel like the reason for that is nothing more than laziness on the part of the FR team. If you don't want to pump treasure into the game, fine. Don't. I agree. But why can't we still be compensated? Going from 55 spaces to 60 spaces costs 215k now. I spent 175k more than I should have. Why can't the amount I spent be deducted from my next lair expansion? If a 60-space lair cost me 40k, we would be even, and nothing after that would require any further adjustments. This price difference can be very easily calculated and applied to anyone with lair spaces of 30-55, with [i]no risk[/i] of pumping that money back into the economy. So why hasn't it? Please explain to me why this isn't a viable option, because I think it's very reasonable and I am offended that, rather than put it into practice, we have effectively been told to shut up and walk away with our losses while bigger, richer lairs see compensation. [b]Edit:[/b] Typo.

I would really like to see an answer to velociriah's question.

[quote name="velociriah" date="2013-11-12 11:19:32"]@Xhaztol [quote name="Xhaztol" date="2013-11-12 02:32:55"][quote name="jastoz" date="2013-11-12 02:11:41"]While adjustments being made only 60 and up seem arbitrary, they're not entirely. Those at 99 deserve to go up to 125, the only question is how far to take that back. Sure, at 55 in the old system you could've paid up to 65 in the new system, but that amount still isn't lost. [b]The different has simply been applied forward.[/b][/quote] This was our main philosophy in going forward with these changes. We opted to not provide treasure reimbursement for this update, as doing so would put millions, if not billions of treasure into the economy (risking inflation) for users with lairs below 60+, which may not have been used by everyone on lair expansions. This creates a [i]somewhat [/i]unfair deal for those with larger lairs, as their adjustments only came in the form of more slots, and not actual currency. Users with lower level lairs may not be receiving tangible 'refunds' via this change, but they are receiving a much sweeter deal on lair expansions going forward, keeping the benefits of the lair adjustments solely within the lair expansion system, and not creating a huge (potentially risky) stimulus. I do not disagree that this may feel like a slight, but would like everyone to know that it most definitely was [i]not [/i]meant as one, and was the most balanced way that we could devise to move forward with the change. We will, of course, keep our eyes peeled on this thread for your feedback, and appreciate every bit of it. :)[/quote] Okay. I get this. I do. And I agree that pumping millions or billions of treasure into the game could be a disaster. But I do [i]not[/i] agree that ignoring a good chunk of your dedicated playerbase is the solution. I have 55 lair spaces. Under the new system, I spent 175k more than I needed to, and got nothing in return. I feel very, very jipped, and I feel like the reason for that is nothing more than laziness on the part of the FR team. If you don't want to pump treasure into the game, fine. Don't. I agree. But why can't re still be compensated? Going from 55 spaces to 60 spaces costs 215k now. I spent 175k more than I should have. Why can't the amount I spent be deducted from my next lair expansion? If a 60-space lair cost me 40k, we would be even, and nothing after that would require any further adjustments. This price difference can be very easily calculated and applied to anyone with lair spaces of 30-55, with [i]no risk[/i] of pumping that money back into the economy. So why hasn't it? Please explain to me why this isn't a viable option, because I think it's very reasonable and I am offended that, rather than put it into practice, we have effectively been told to shut up and walk away with our losses while bigger, richer lairs see compensation.[/quote] This is a great way of expressing exactly what I've been feeling. Thanks!

I solemnly tip my hat to those that can eat the loss with equanimity that I have seen in this thread. But with all due respect, I can't be happy about it and I don't think I am being unreasonable in saying so.

I'm not denying we're getting a benefit - of sorts - regardless of treasure loss. No matter what, eventually I should have 125 slots by paying a net amount of 'only' 175k extra for the ones after 99. It's still 175k more than other people had to pay for the same benefit. To go back to the example I posted a bit ago, I'm still getting 200,000 of the bonus, and of course I'm grateful for that. But it would take a saint to not be resentful of only getting 200,000 of the bonus when my next-door neighbors are getting the full 1,000,000 bonus, just because of luck. And unfortunately I'm not a saint so yes, if they don't fix this somehow I will be resentful for quite a long while. I'll get over the treasure unfairness eventually, but it's a chunk of trust in the site and its admins that I'd have lost and that I will not ever get back.

What this is costing those of us who got shafted by this expansion is opportunity and the time and work we spent to get it, and it stings like alcohol in an open wound. My lair will forever be one gembond scroll less than it could've been. Or less a dream imp (or two, with current prices). Or less an awesome rare familiar or two. Or less some other future gene. Or less a few nests hatching (and all profit from them) because I didn't have space and had to wait and earn extra money to pay double for one of my expansions when I shouldn't have had to. Regardless, it will be less, and I wasted days and hours of my time for that less and now am apparently being told to lump it and like it. Darn right I'm going to complain.

And development? Not really, if things are built like I would expect. I live and breathe databases. It's how I earn my living. I know it can be done. Assuming their database has proper information organized reasonably well within it, I could write an update query in less than 15 minutes that would (for example):
- calculate my overpay based on date of last lair expansion before the update and lair size from that expansion,
- calculate the cost of my next expansion after that minus my overpay,
- detect if I have enough treasure to pay that amount, (stop here if I didn't)
- deduct that remaining cost needed for the next expansion from my treasure, and
- bump me up to the next slot level.
No code change needed to the site, just a data update behind the scenes, just like how I presume they refill our hunger bars after some snafu messes them up. And yes, depending on database structure that could easily be done all in one query. Seriously, give me a peek at the database structure and some sample data and I will write the query for them. Free of charge.

They could do it on a ticket-by-ticket basis - person sends a message to the help email address indicating they want this done, dev plugs their userid into the query, and runs it - instant fix for that person. Yes I agree a blanket fix for everyone wouldn't work - they won't all have the treasure to make up the difference, they won't all want the next upgrade - thus the ticket-by-ticket basis. Only fix those who ask to be fixed.

I can't deny it would still be a lot of exhausting, repetitive work for the person handling those tickets - plugging in a new userid, running the fix, plugging in the next userid, running the fix, over and over and over, potentially thousands of times. I've been there and I fully sympathize. But honestly... that's the corner everyone's been painted into with how this grand-intentioned-but-badly-planned thing was deployed, and if they want to be fair, it's got to be done.

Of course that's assuming they want it to be fair. :/
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I'm losing faith that they do. :c

Life's not fair; I know that as well as anybody. I'm not a kid and haven't been one for a long time. But I have no respect for people who hide behind that as an excuse to refuse to make a little bit of it more fair for everyone when it is well within their power to do so, and worse, knowingly and intentionally inflict additional unfairness and then stand back, holding their hands high and feigning innocence or saying it's 'for the greater good'.

I never liked Albus Dumbledore.

*edit* Yes exactly what velociriah said.

Sheesh. So many people going why can't I get my money back? Wah wah wah. :( If they let all the 55 lairs get the same that the 60's did, the 50 lairs would complain. If they then increased it to include the 50's, the 45's would complain!

Just accept the gift for what it is people! You get to buy cheaper slots now! Yay~
So you don't get your money back.. well, too bad! You get what you get and don't pitch a fit!

@Xhaztol, from what I understood from your post on page 15, the extra money that people with lairs smaller than 60 have paid would go "forward" towards future expansions (thereby reducing their price by the amount extra that we paid in). However, I am still seeing that my next epxansion (from 45 to 50) is 150,000 treasure. This means that it did not "pay forward", as it were. Which means that the extra that I paid in is just gone. I totally understand you guys not wanting to reimburse those people under 60 with tangible treasure, but it would make sense to reduce the price of the next expansion for those who paid in by the amount extra that they paid in.

I'm sorry if someone else has already pointed this out; I haven't read through all 34 pages yet.

Edit: -cough- basically exactly what @velociriah said much more clearly than I.