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TOPIC | What would you have done? (eye update)
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For me, personally? 1. Sooner*. 2. Failing that, more communication when the devs decided to do a 180 from their initial statement of "we think it's important that the eyes be RNG only going forward" (in their statement about why they considered Scattersights a mistake) to "the eye update was a mistake." Letting the playerbase know it's a mistake, without being specific about how and when it will be fixed, lets people who were more reliant on that RNG for enjoyment adjust and brace themselves before the update. Like, to be clear, I'm not asking for intense, drawn-out explanations of "this is the process we used to determine it," or "you may grill us now," because a limited number of staff can make that [i]really[/i] exhausting and draining on extremely limited human resources that might be needed elsewhere, but [i]some[/i] brief but clear way of letting the userbase being able to brace themselves for such a drastic shift would have been deeply appreciated, in retrospect, by both people positively and negatively affected. I get that I can only speak for myself, but I am fairly certain that nobody was happy with this update for the surprise factor, so that could have been taken away without consequence. [emoji=ridgeback laughing size=1] And it's not like hiding it stopped people from arguing in the forums, so… I get that a call was probably made, and maybe there's information I don't have access to, but… hey, I don't have access to it, so all I know is that I would have been happier with warning and a lot of other people are saying the same. That's it, though. I'm fine with the eye update itself; the prices were a bit of a shock to me, but I've come around to them, and I do deeply appreciate that they're a much-needed expensive but recurring treasure sink at a time when treasure was rapidly becoming worth less and less. Edit: * To clarify, I was perfectly okay with the initial eye update after an adjustment period, it's just that releasing something like this sooner allows less time for people to become firmly entrenched in a certain playstyle and for new people joining to feel like it's always and will always be there, which would make the transition less difficult overall.
For me, personally?

1. Sooner*.

2. Failing that, more communication when the devs decided to do a 180 from their initial statement of "we think it's important that the eyes be RNG only going forward" (in their statement about why they considered Scattersights a mistake) to "the eye update was a mistake." Letting the playerbase know it's a mistake, without being specific about how and when it will be fixed, lets people who were more reliant on that RNG for enjoyment adjust and brace themselves before the update.

Like, to be clear, I'm not asking for intense, drawn-out explanations of "this is the process we used to determine it," or "you may grill us now," because a limited number of staff can make that really exhausting and draining on extremely limited human resources that might be needed elsewhere, but some brief but clear way of letting the userbase being able to brace themselves for such a drastic shift would have been deeply appreciated, in retrospect, by both people positively and negatively affected.

I get that I can only speak for myself, but I am fairly certain that nobody was happy with this update for the surprise factor, so that could have been taken away without consequence. And it's not like hiding it stopped people from arguing in the forums, so… I get that a call was probably made, and maybe there's information I don't have access to, but… hey, I don't have access to it, so all I know is that I would have been happier with warning and a lot of other people are saying the same.

That's it, though. I'm fine with the eye update itself; the prices were a bit of a shock to me, but I've come around to them, and I do deeply appreciate that they're a much-needed expensive but recurring treasure sink at a time when treasure was rapidly becoming worth less and less.

Edit: * To clarify, I was perfectly okay with the initial eye update after an adjustment period, it's just that releasing something like this sooner allows less time for people to become firmly entrenched in a certain playstyle and for new people joining to feel like it's always and will always be there, which would make the transition less difficult overall.
like lots of ppl have said, do it sooner.

literally just have scattersight 2 with better odds and all the new eyes, and make that drop always in the coli (maybe it's also got other ways to get it during fests/notn or something). it would be rare, so having special eyes would still be kinda hard to get, but it would allow ppl to get whatever eyes they wanted with enough work.
like lots of ppl have said, do it sooner.

literally just have scattersight 2 with better odds and all the new eyes, and make that drop always in the coli (maybe it's also got other ways to get it during fests/notn or something). it would be rare, so having special eyes would still be kinda hard to get, but it would allow ppl to get whatever eyes they wanted with enough work.
I think...the only thing I would have done was just fix it sooner. I can't really blame them too much for taking so long though as this whole situation falls into the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" category. [emoji=guardian sad size=1] It's pretty clear from the original anniversary update that they were super passionate about the idea, but by the time they implemented it it didn't fit into how a lot of people were actually playing the game. (Obviously if this had been a thing since the game start, probably wouldn't have been a issue at all.) Then by the Goat update it was also clear that there was likely no way they could keep introducing this thing they loved with the original mechanics without majorly stirring up the community every single time. SO THEN on to the dilemma of how to fix it. Even by the goat update there were players that genuinely enjoyed the thing, so literally no matter what they did one way or another or when they did it they were going to upset somebody. But in the end I am glad they fixed it though! For many, many reasons, but I will spare people from the text wall. [emoji=guardian winking size=1]
I think...the only thing I would have done was just fix it sooner. I can't really blame them too much for taking so long though as this whole situation falls into the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" category.

It's pretty clear from the original anniversary update that they were super passionate about the idea, but by the time they implemented it it didn't fit into how a lot of people were actually playing the game. (Obviously if this had been a thing since the game start, probably wouldn't have been a issue at all.) Then by the Goat update it was also clear that there was likely no way they could keep introducing this thing they loved with the original mechanics without majorly stirring up the community every single time. SO THEN on to the dilemma of how to fix it. Even by the goat update there were players that genuinely enjoyed the thing, so literally no matter what they did one way or another or when they did it they were going to upset somebody.

But in the end I am glad they fixed it though! For many, many reasons, but I will spare people from the text wall.
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If it were up to me, the whole original eye fiasco would never have happened as I value accessibility over any sort of market. The eyes would have all been added to the game as a possible random element in breeding BUT also with vials that are dispersed throughout the game. They wouldn't all have been in the Treasure Marketplace but instead some would be at Swipp's, some would be at Baldo's, some would be in the Coliseum, etc. That would provide a challenge to those who like it while anyone who doesn't want to partake in a feature of the site can easily buy them from the AH. No retiring either.
If it were up to me, the whole original eye fiasco would never have happened as I value accessibility over any sort of market. The eyes would have all been added to the game as a possible random element in breeding BUT also with vials that are dispersed throughout the game. They wouldn't all have been in the Treasure Marketplace but instead some would be at Swipp's, some would be at Baldo's, some would be in the Coliseum, etc. That would provide a challenge to those who like it while anyone who doesn't want to partake in a feature of the site can easily buy them from the AH. No retiring either.
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I wouldn't have broken my word

It's hard to make the eyes more accessible tho, since the original update was unfair
But two unfair decisions don't make it correct I think

I'd have released cool elemental eyes via the holydays
Not the same as primal, but representing the elements in another way
They'd have been more accessible for those who want flashy elemental eyes, without ruining primal eyes ('ruining' as for me and a bunch of others, it's fine if you think they were enhanced)

That's the closest I'd get with making cool eyes accessible... But I see no way to make primal eyes (and the others) accessible without breaking promises and personally, I'd value my word over everything
I wouldn't have broken my word

It's hard to make the eyes more accessible tho, since the original update was unfair
But two unfair decisions don't make it correct I think

I'd have released cool elemental eyes via the holydays
Not the same as primal, but representing the elements in another way
They'd have been more accessible for those who want flashy elemental eyes, without ruining primal eyes ('ruining' as for me and a bunch of others, it's fine if you think they were enhanced)

That's the closest I'd get with making cool eyes accessible... But I see no way to make primal eyes (and the others) accessible without breaking promises and personally, I'd value my word over everything
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I would have just made scattervials stay a permanent part of FR. via baldwin coli and add them to MP for a base price. instead of retiring.

Made "normal" eyetypes: goat, uncommon, unusual, rare, Bright and pastel, into MP vials.

Thats the only thing.

After reading a bajillion threads about eyes all this time, I think the original discontent about the "eyepocalypse" at first was because of having eyes turned "rng" and a lot of players were upset about the rng of it; there was a huge amount of backlash over the RNG of it. But that discontent over the rng factor faded as people got used to the eye system, and shifted over to the fact that the scattervials were just actually not available, except from other players at an insane cost, and had been retired after a really short amount of time, instead of staying around as a permanent item.

From what I understand, since i had missed the eyepocalypse update due to a hiatus, scattervials were worth A LOT less when the update happened originally, but the cost of them just inflated and then continued to inflate to ridiculous proportions as time went on and people thinned out the market by consuming literally hundreds for just a single dragon.

I do think leaving customization as a gamble, in the hands of players alone was a huge mistake.
I dont think having a specific RNG items are inherently bad. But retiring that RNG item was largely part of my discontent with the original eye update.

If the scattervials were just continued and available for all time customizing would have been more feasible to customize some of the hundreds of millions of dragons that existed pre-eye update.

The staff called the vials themselves a mistake, but the real mistake was retiring them.
I would have just made scattervials stay a permanent part of FR. via baldwin coli and add them to MP for a base price. instead of retiring.

Made "normal" eyetypes: goat, uncommon, unusual, rare, Bright and pastel, into MP vials.

Thats the only thing.

After reading a bajillion threads about eyes all this time, I think the original discontent about the "eyepocalypse" at first was because of having eyes turned "rng" and a lot of players were upset about the rng of it; there was a huge amount of backlash over the RNG of it. But that discontent over the rng factor faded as people got used to the eye system, and shifted over to the fact that the scattervials were just actually not available, except from other players at an insane cost, and had been retired after a really short amount of time, instead of staying around as a permanent item.

From what I understand, since i had missed the eyepocalypse update due to a hiatus, scattervials were worth A LOT less when the update happened originally, but the cost of them just inflated and then continued to inflate to ridiculous proportions as time went on and people thinned out the market by consuming literally hundreds for just a single dragon.

I do think leaving customization as a gamble, in the hands of players alone was a huge mistake.
I dont think having a specific RNG items are inherently bad. But retiring that RNG item was largely part of my discontent with the original eye update.

If the scattervials were just continued and available for all time customizing would have been more feasible to customize some of the hundreds of millions of dragons that existed pre-eye update.

The staff called the vials themselves a mistake, but the real mistake was retiring them.
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Personally I think adding more unnatural eyes would have been a great option elemental eyes that where similar to primal but not exactly the same would have been great and could have helped with some of the less popular primals such as earth this would have been more work for the staff though.

The best solution really would have been to just do things differently with the initial eye update or change it right after but obviously that's not an option. Scattersights really shouldn't have been released or been permanently available. I really don't know why they made another consumable retired item when they made the festival items not retired
Personally I think adding more unnatural eyes would have been a great option elemental eyes that where similar to primal but not exactly the same would have been great and could have helped with some of the less popular primals such as earth this would have been more work for the staff though.

The best solution really would have been to just do things differently with the initial eye update or change it right after but obviously that's not an option. Scattersights really shouldn't have been released or been permanently available. I really don't know why they made another consumable retired item when they made the festival items not retired
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Step 1: warn players several months in advance that a fix is being discussed. state that you know it's been a long time and you apologize for that, but you're giving warning to allow people to begin adjusting their playstyle
Step 2: when a method is chosen TELL USERS what it will be
Step 3: listen to feedback, make appropriate changes if you feel they fit as a dev
Step 4: THEN release the update

if you're asking what i'd've done instead of stuffing them all in the treasure mp, exalt a natural primal to get a primal vial, etc. in order to keep it tied to hatching.
Step 1: warn players several months in advance that a fix is being discussed. state that you know it's been a long time and you apologize for that, but you're giving warning to allow people to begin adjusting their playstyle
Step 2: when a method is chosen TELL USERS what it will be
Step 3: listen to feedback, make appropriate changes if you feel they fit as a dev
Step 4: THEN release the update

if you're asking what i'd've done instead of stuffing them all in the treasure mp, exalt a natural primal to get a primal vial, etc. in order to keep it tied to hatching.
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I woulda made new eye types for treasure but left the old ones alone (at least left goat/facet/Multi-Gaze/primal alone). I don’t mind treasure vials but with the types I listed, they have lost their magic now. So if I ever hatch one of em again, they’d be exalted as usual.
I woulda made new eye types for treasure but left the old ones alone (at least left goat/facet/Multi-Gaze/primal alone). I don’t mind treasure vials but with the types I listed, they have lost their magic now. So if I ever hatch one of em again, they’d be exalted as usual.
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[quote name="@Empedocles" date="2021-05-09 09:02:54" ] I woulda made new eye types for treasure but left the old ones alone (at least left goat/facet/Multi-Gaze/primal alone). I don’t mind treasure vials but with the types I listed, they have lost their magic now. So if I ever hatch one of em again, they’d be exalted as usual. [/quote] goat isnt an old eyetype, it came out later and you couldnt get it with scattervials. it was only obtainable through the galore gifted clanbound vials or hatching. It came out the same time as Swirl they even went out of their way to mention eyetypes from scattervials remain unaltered in the goat/swirl update and that they updated the scattersight tooltip to indicate which eyetypes could be obtained.
@Empedocles wrote on 2021-05-09 09:02:54:
I woulda made new eye types for treasure but left the old ones alone (at least left goat/facet/Multi-Gaze/primal alone). I don’t mind treasure vials but with the types I listed, they have lost their magic now. So if I ever hatch one of em again, they’d be exalted as usual.
goat isnt an old eyetype,
it came out later and you couldnt get it with scattervials. it was only obtainable through the galore gifted clanbound vials or hatching.
It came out the same time as Swirl

they even went out of their way to mention eyetypes from scattervials remain unaltered in the goat/swirl update and that they updated the scattersight tooltip to indicate which eyetypes could be obtained.
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