Remember, these cycled NOW and this is a guaranteed time for these items to cycle back in, we will very likely get more opportunities during the year. While I personally don't mind the cycling of Gem items, as long as they're not straight up retired, that's good, BUT everyone else's concerns are spot on.
Not everyone can save up easily, not everyone can buy a Gem pack, not everyone has the means to wait for the items to cycle in.
I am all for the Staff getting the money they deserve, they're a small team running a huge site with continuous new content being released and asked for, so having purchases like these giving them a nice bonus before the holidays is well deserved. They're offering a free service (as long as you have an internet connection) while those who can buy will buy and support them.
Flight Rising is an incredibly fair website/"game" compared to what I've seen usually in which the devs, which are larger companies, prioritise money and P2W players over their regular playerbase - this does not happen on FR.
HOWEVER, I am very much against this randomness, scarcity and unpredictability. I kindly ask of you, Staff, to introduce a schedule for these items. Something that I'd love to see:
- Happy Hours - as I have stated, giving people the incentive to save up their real life money and Gems to purchase Gem items at a discount would be phenomenal for people who have the means to afford luxury, those who are just playing AND the devs; I'm suggesting a semi-scheduled 3-day period in which Gem Marketplace items are discounted at the same or slightly lower rate flash sale items are
- item cycle schedule - a proper schedule, like someone had already mentioned, such as cycling them in every 3 months or so; people will have a more reliable schedule to rely on and save for
- other Gem pack bonuses - Gem pack bonuses could happen a bit more frequently, I'm always down for a bonus and a deal if it can happen (you just gotta be clever about it)
- Gem pack discounts - I have seen people last year mention how FR Black Friday bonuses are measly compared to other games and sites and that is true to an extent, but remember the small team point; regardless, I'd very gladly cash out a bit to support the site further, a 10% discount on Gem packs occasionally would work wonders
- timer icon on MP items - those that are meant to cycle out should have a timer icon added to them so people know when things are going to cycle out; if you had a cycle schedule, you could add that to the next bunch on that day and people would have the time to save up
If anyone else has any ideas, please share. Remember tho, being constructive is key, there's no need for passive aggression.
Remember, these cycled NOW and this is a guaranteed time for these items to cycle back in, we will very likely get more opportunities during the year. While I personally don't mind the cycling of Gem items, as long as they're not straight up retired, that's good, BUT everyone else's concerns are spot on.
Not everyone can save up easily, not everyone can buy a Gem pack, not everyone has the means to wait for the items to cycle in.
I am all for the Staff getting the money they deserve, they're a small team running a huge site with continuous new content being released and asked for, so having purchases like these giving them a nice bonus before the holidays is well deserved. They're offering a free service (as long as you have an internet connection) while those who can buy will buy and support them.
Flight Rising is an incredibly fair website/"game" compared to what I've seen usually in which the devs, which are larger companies, prioritise money and P2W players over their regular playerbase - this does not happen on FR.
HOWEVER, I am very much against this randomness, scarcity and unpredictability. I kindly ask of you, Staff, to introduce a schedule for these items. Something that I'd love to see:
- Happy Hours - as I have stated, giving people the incentive to save up their real life money and Gems to purchase Gem items at a discount would be phenomenal for people who have the means to afford luxury, those who are just playing AND the devs; I'm suggesting a semi-scheduled 3-day period in which Gem Marketplace items are discounted at the same or slightly lower rate flash sale items are
- item cycle schedule - a proper schedule, like someone had already mentioned, such as cycling them in every 3 months or so; people will have a more reliable schedule to rely on and save for
- other Gem pack bonuses - Gem pack bonuses could happen a bit more frequently, I'm always down for a bonus and a deal if it can happen (you just gotta be clever about it)
- Gem pack discounts - I have seen people last year mention how FR Black Friday bonuses are measly compared to other games and sites and that is true to an extent, but remember the small team point; regardless, I'd very gladly cash out a bit to support the site further, a 10% discount on Gem packs occasionally would work wonders
- timer icon on MP items - those that are meant to cycle out should have a timer icon added to them so people know when things are going to cycle out; if you had a cycle schedule, you could add that to the next bunch on that day and people would have the time to save up
If anyone else has any ideas, please share. Remember tho, being constructive is key, there's no need for passive aggression.
[quote name="DigitalMirage" date="2022-11-28 08:50:21" ]
Are we going to see items removed during the May cycle as well? What's the process and decision making going into which items get removed? Are you able to see the raw stats of which items get bought more often than others (outside of the Hot Items tab?)
[/quote]
There are no plans to add more items to the cycle in May. This is not double removal, this is an additional week to have cycled items back that is predictable for our players and can now be planned around without it being a mystery.
These items were chosen because they were some of the oldest items in the gem marketplace and have been around for almost a decade in a tab that's very full. They are all from the first year of release. After reading through the feedback here age will no longer be the sole basis for cycling items out, and we will likely be more choosy with what (if anything) gets added to the cycle pool each November.
[quote name="O1NKer" date="2022-11-28 08:51:46" ]
are the items that are cycling out permanently gone? or will they come back on the said "week of May 8-15"?
[/quote]
They are all coming back May 8-15. Everything you see in today's post!
DigitalMirage wrote on 2022-11-28 08:50:21:
Are we going to see items removed during the May cycle as well? What's the process and decision making going into which items get removed? Are you able to see the raw stats of which items get bought more often than others (outside of the Hot Items tab?)
There are no plans to add more items to the cycle in May. This is not double removal, this is an additional week to have cycled items back that is predictable for our players and can now be planned around without it being a mystery.
These items were chosen because they were some of the oldest items in the gem marketplace and have been around for almost a decade in a tab that's very full. They are all from the first year of release. After reading through the feedback here age will no longer be the sole basis for cycling items out, and we will likely be more choosy with what (if anything) gets added to the cycle pool each November.
O1NKer wrote on 2022-11-28 08:51:46:
are the items that are cycling out permanently gone? or will they come back on the said "week of May 8-15"?
They are all coming back May 8-15. Everything you see in today's post!
Ahhh been waiting for this all year! Decided to fill out my bestiary after last NotN, and been waiting for the cycled fams. <3 Four more down!
Ahhh been waiting for this all year! Decided to fill out my bestiary after last NotN, and been waiting for the cycled fams. <3 Four more down!
[quote name="arawoods" date="2022-11-28 08:22:34" ]
are you going to say that any company that ever participates in black friday is evil for tempting people to spend at the same time or something? it's just a random day (or days, considering cuber monday) chosen by society for sales to happen and that's it
[/quote]
It's... a very different thing in comparison, black friday sales are different from actively [i]taking away[/i] something that was always available and very popular, just to "generate buzz" next time it arrives. It's not just a sale and a discount, it's the fear of missing out: "get this while you have the chance, because one week later those items are gone". Black friday won't take your favorite pullover away if you don't buy it [i]right now[/i], it just tempts you with a discount, that's all :D [s]i love pullovers[/s]
arawoods wrote on 2022-11-28 08:22:34:
are you going to say that any company that ever participates in black friday is evil for tempting people to spend at the same time or something? it's just a random day (or days, considering cuber monday) chosen by society for sales to happen and that's it
It's... a very different thing in comparison, black friday sales are different from actively
taking away something that was always available and very popular, just to "generate buzz" next time it arrives. It's not just a sale and a discount, it's the fear of missing out: "get this while you have the chance, because one week later those items are gone". Black friday won't take your favorite pullover away if you don't buy it
right now, it just tempts you with a discount, that's all :D
i love pullovers
[quote name="DigitalMirage" date="2022-11-28 09:03:39" ]
[quote name="Empyreal" date="2022-11-28 08:54:29" ]
[quote name="Spuk" date="2022-11-28 08:41:14" ]
Glad there's a new sale cycle, still think its a rather questionable decision to pull popular apparel items from cycle yet again. That doesn't feel like "keeping things fresh". That just feels irritating. It would make more sense to cycle out things no one uses instead of popular apparel items even from a business stand point.
[/quote]
Except these are mostly incredibly niche older items I rarely see used. From my experience, outside people yelling here, these aren't hugely popular outside certain groups. By my point of view, they are doing exactly what you suggest.
The issue is, you want them to apply an incredibly subjective metric in a way you expect, and when it doesn't match your view, it's wrong.
For all we know, they are actually applying it as suggested based on real item sale rates.
[/quote]
The biggest difference between the items getting cycled out versus the ones that aren't is that items like the Daredevil covers do not have a treasure marketplace equivalent. Exclusively popular items like swords and pets would create too much outrage amongst the userbase. There is still a steady community that [i]does[/i] buy these items (edit: being cycled out.) Not the least of which, that community consists of g1 collectors. Which, regardless of how they acquire their funds (either through gameplay or purchase,) it is a userbase that frequently uses the gem currency.
This still doesn't answer the question as to why the team feels it necessary to pull items, other than to create false scarcity. At best, it only has the interest of the site's funding in mind, and at worst it's a blatant disregard for community concerns.
edit addition: why alienate [i]any[/i] % of the userbase for the sake of trying to grab more funds for the site? There should be other solutions to trying to generate more funds put into the website. Watching people confess that they refuse to purchase gems because of tarnished trust in the website should dash the idea that this remains a permanent feature.
[/quote]
You did not address my point, which wasn't actually defending cycling.
I was pointing out that the user I was replying to was taking a rather selfish "don't cycle items I like, cycle other Items instead." take. And seeing as WC scrolls are already on the cycling no other scrolls are being added, I fail to see why G1 collectors are being brought up regarding my comment.(unless it's because the covers allow bad eyes to be covered?)
I was merely pointing out that no matter how cycling is done, someone will be disappointed.
To be honest, 20 pages is a lot of apparel to go through and I forgot the covers existed because of that. There is a reason to cycle. Perhaps it needs to be done differently, but there is logic to why, and it's nothing to do with artificial scarcity. As of right now, I only look when new items are added or I find something for an outfit in the dressing room because there's just too much there.
DigitalMirage wrote on 2022-11-28 09:03:39:
Empyreal wrote on 2022-11-28 08:54:29:
Spuk wrote on 2022-11-28 08:41:14:
Glad there's a new sale cycle, still think its a rather questionable decision to pull popular apparel items from cycle yet again. That doesn't feel like "keeping things fresh". That just feels irritating. It would make more sense to cycle out things no one uses instead of popular apparel items even from a business stand point.
Except these are mostly incredibly niche older items I rarely see used. From my experience, outside people yelling here, these aren't hugely popular outside certain groups. By my point of view, they are doing exactly what you suggest.
The issue is, you want them to apply an incredibly subjective metric in a way you expect, and when it doesn't match your view, it's wrong.
For all we know, they are actually applying it as suggested based on real item sale rates.
The biggest difference between the items getting cycled out versus the ones that aren't is that items like the Daredevil covers do not have a treasure marketplace equivalent. Exclusively popular items like swords and pets would create too much outrage amongst the userbase. There is still a steady community that
does buy these items (edit: being cycled out.) Not the least of which, that community consists of g1 collectors. Which, regardless of how they acquire their funds (either through gameplay or purchase,) it is a userbase that frequently uses the gem currency.
This still doesn't answer the question as to why the team feels it necessary to pull items, other than to create false scarcity. At best, it only has the interest of the site's funding in mind, and at worst it's a blatant disregard for community concerns.
edit addition: why alienate
any % of the userbase for the sake of trying to grab more funds for the site? There should be other solutions to trying to generate more funds put into the website. Watching people confess that they refuse to purchase gems because of tarnished trust in the website should dash the idea that this remains a permanent feature.
You did not address my point, which wasn't actually defending cycling.
I was pointing out that the user I was replying to was taking a rather selfish "don't cycle items I like, cycle other Items instead." take. And seeing as WC scrolls are already on the cycling no other scrolls are being added, I fail to see why G1 collectors are being brought up regarding my comment.(unless it's because the covers allow bad eyes to be covered?)
I was merely pointing out that no matter how cycling is done, someone will be disappointed.
To be honest, 20 pages is a lot of apparel to go through and I forgot the covers existed because of that. There is a reason to cycle. Perhaps it needs to be done differently, but there is logic to why, and it's nothing to do with artificial scarcity. As of right now, I only look when new items are added or I find something for an outfit in the dressing room because there's just too much there.
My opinion - I love the way FR "cycles" items rather than retiring them fully. Most other game/adoptable sites fully retire stuff and the only way to get the item, familiar, or whatever else it may be, is by user trading. Prices skyrocket, and then literally no one is happy except for the users who bought the item early and held on to it.
The dates that these items cycle is incredibly visible and now has been publicly confirmed to be a set thing for the foreseeable future. You have months to prepare both in game and real life funds if you so choose to spend real money. I started playing FR again early this year, and I immediately became aware of the Cyber Monday sale. I have been sitting on my real life money waiting for this week to buy a ton of gems.
I understand that this is a money heavy time in FR between the new ancient, festival, Cyber Cycle Monday, and NotN - but once again, most of these are yearly set dates. Cyber Monday is always the Monday after Thanksgiving. Festivals are always set dates. NotN you can roughly estimate when it is going to fall. All it does it take a bit of preparing so you can enjoy/get everything you want without having to break the bank in real life or spend a crazy amount of time grinding on FR during this month. The ancient did throw off my planning a bit, but that is just a small drop in the bucket.
It's ok to have to wait/save for something, not everything needs to be an instant reward. I understand wanting everything, I'm a hoarder at heart and want literally everything, but sometimes you have to make choices - that is just life for you. Now it's only a 6 month wait rather than a year, that is pretty awesome!
My opinion - I love the way FR "cycles" items rather than retiring them fully. Most other game/adoptable sites fully retire stuff and the only way to get the item, familiar, or whatever else it may be, is by user trading. Prices skyrocket, and then literally no one is happy except for the users who bought the item early and held on to it.
The dates that these items cycle is incredibly visible and now has been publicly confirmed to be a set thing for the foreseeable future. You have months to prepare both in game and real life funds if you so choose to spend real money. I started playing FR again early this year, and I immediately became aware of the Cyber Monday sale. I have been sitting on my real life money waiting for this week to buy a ton of gems.
I understand that this is a money heavy time in FR between the new ancient, festival, Cyber Cycle Monday, and NotN - but once again, most of these are yearly set dates. Cyber Monday is always the Monday after Thanksgiving. Festivals are always set dates. NotN you can roughly estimate when it is going to fall. All it does it take a bit of preparing so you can enjoy/get everything you want without having to break the bank in real life or spend a crazy amount of time grinding on FR during this month. The ancient did throw off my planning a bit, but that is just a small drop in the bucket.
It's ok to have to wait/save for something, not everything needs to be an instant reward. I understand wanting everything, I'm a hoarder at heart and want literally everything, but sometimes you have to make choices - that is just life for you. Now it's only a 6 month wait rather than a year, that is pretty awesome!
Thank you for at least managing to fix a lot of the issues with this, undel and staff.
I may not be able to use money, but I can save up for stuff I need.
Once again, I'm sorry that a lot of us seemed harsh, at least you guys are making it a scheduled cycle and returning all items within a set period.
Thank you for at least managing to fix a lot of the issues with this, undel and staff.
I may not be able to use money, but I can save up for stuff I need.
Once again, I'm sorry that a lot of us seemed harsh, at least you guys are making it a scheduled cycle and returning all items within a set period.
For participation in Thursday oof water raffle
I didn't mind the once-per-year cycle when I knew it'd definitely be for Cyber Monday, and now I'm really happy that we're going to get another in May. I really like the steps staff is taking to make cycles less of a surprise! :D I figured when the previous Cyber Monday sale happened that they'd be doing it again this year, so I'm very happy I was right and it'll be a scheduled thing now!
Personally, even as someone who despises FOMO, I'm kind of finding it hard to see how this is such a case? When I think of FOMO, I think of items that will never come back. Think Battle Pass rewards that'll no longer be available when the season ends, or DV's monthly sets (they say they'll be returning but it's been years I no longer believe them). In this case, the items will be returning, so I don't consider it to be any more FOMO than NotN or Pirate Day or Warrior's Way stuff? (And I'm referring to the gem items these events have!) Which I also don't consider these to be FOMO at all because they'll always be coming back.
I also understand why staff is cycling out more items - with every new apparel set, chances are there will be a gem MP version. I'm glad there's a search function in the MP because oh my god trying to find the apparel piece I want is a nightmare otherwise, and cycling things out seems to be the staff's solution to how loaded it is. Is it the best solution? I don't know, but it's one that I'm willing to accept and understand. I think, moving forward, staff should focus less on cycling apparel based on how old it is and perhaps, if they can track it, move to cycling apparel that wasn't bought that much anyway in comparison to others.
Either way though, I'm really happy with how responsive staff has been and how they've been willing to hear players out. I was very surprised to hear how swiftly they decided to give us another cycle in May, so thank you for that, staff! :D
I didn't mind the once-per-year cycle when I knew it'd definitely be for Cyber Monday, and now I'm really happy that we're going to get another in May. I really like the steps staff is taking to make cycles less of a surprise! :D I figured when the previous Cyber Monday sale happened that they'd be doing it again this year, so I'm very happy I was right and it'll be a scheduled thing now!
Personally, even as someone who despises FOMO, I'm kind of finding it hard to see how this is such a case? When I think of FOMO, I think of items that will never come back. Think Battle Pass rewards that'll no longer be available when the season ends, or DV's monthly sets (they say they'll be returning but it's been years I no longer believe them). In this case, the items will be returning, so I don't consider it to be any more FOMO than NotN or Pirate Day or Warrior's Way stuff? (And I'm referring to the gem items these events have!) Which I also don't consider these to be FOMO at all because they'll always be coming back.
I also understand why staff is cycling out more items - with every new apparel set, chances are there will be a gem MP version. I'm glad there's a search function in the MP because oh my god trying to find the apparel piece I want is a nightmare otherwise, and cycling things out seems to be the staff's solution to how loaded it is. Is it the best solution? I don't know, but it's one that I'm willing to accept and understand. I think, moving forward, staff should focus less on cycling apparel based on how old it is and perhaps, if they can track it, move to cycling apparel that wasn't bought that much anyway in comparison to others.
Either way though, I'm really happy with how responsive staff has been and how they've been willing to hear players out. I was very surprised to hear how swiftly they decided to give us another cycle in May, so thank you for that, staff! :D
This is another thing I already said in the suggestions thread, but I just want to echo it here; I really appreciate the quick response to feedback!
[quote name="Jinoga" date="2022-11-28 10:08:34"] Personally, even as someone who despises FOMO, I'm kind of finding it hard to see how this is such a case? When I think of FOMO, I think of items that will never come back. Think Battle Pass rewards that'll no longer be available when the season ends, or DV's monthly sets (they say they'll be returning but it's been years I no longer believe them). In this case, the items will be returning, so I don't consider it to be any more FOMO than NotN or Pirate Day or Warrior's Way stuff? Which I also don't consider these to be FOMO at all because they'll always be coming back.[/quote]
I think the difference is 1. the idea is that people will use real money to buy these, while stuff like Warrior's Way currency is free and easier to get large amounts of before the event ends anyway 2. people have been worried about missing out because there hasn't been any consistent schedule to when stuff like WC scrolls cycle in, and so scramble to get gems to buy them because who knows how long they'll have to wait otherwise.
I definitely would not go as far as to say it's predatory, as some people have, but it is rather unfair to players who don't have the budget to spend on gems on short notice. But knowing that things are going to cycle on Cyber Monday and in May going forward should definitely help!
This is another thing I already said in the suggestions thread, but I just want to echo it here; I really appreciate the quick response to feedback!
Jinoga wrote on 2022-11-28 10:08:34:
Personally, even as someone who despises FOMO, I'm kind of finding it hard to see how this is such a case? When I think of FOMO, I think of items that will never come back. Think Battle Pass rewards that'll no longer be available when the season ends, or DV's monthly sets (they say they'll be returning but it's been years I no longer believe them). In this case, the items will be returning, so I don't consider it to be any more FOMO than NotN or Pirate Day or Warrior's Way stuff? Which I also don't consider these to be FOMO at all because they'll always be coming back.
I think the difference is 1. the idea is that people will use real money to buy these, while stuff like Warrior's Way currency is free and easier to get large amounts of before the event ends anyway 2. people have been worried about missing out because there hasn't been any consistent schedule to when stuff like WC scrolls cycle in, and so scramble to get gems to buy them because who knows how long they'll have to wait otherwise.
I definitely would not go as far as to say it's predatory, as some people have, but it is rather unfair to players who don't have the budget to spend on gems on short notice. But knowing that things are going to cycle on Cyber Monday and in May going forward should definitely help!
