Disability-friendly QoL features | Suggestions

Bond-All is a clear no, but I would like some another way to bond with your hoarded familiars. Maybe even a page for familiars attached to dragons only if they can’t do hoarded. Familiar Bonding feels quite clunky, so I do think it needs improvements.

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December 29, 2023 13:44:40

Bond-All is a clear no, but I would like some another way to bond with your hoarded familiars. Maybe even a page for familiars attached to dragons only if they can’t do hoarded. Familiar Bonding feels quite clunky, so I do think it needs improvements.

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[quote name="wishbonewarren" date="2023-12-29 13:44:35" ] I'm curious why so many responses are focusing on whether familiar bonding is essential to the game. Does that mean more essential features (like coli) should be less challenging & complex? (That seems backwards.) Or just that it isn't worth the resources to rework nonessential features? [/quote] I was wondering this too. I actually get where OP is coming from here: there is a clear bit of privilege when it comes to taking advantage of the familiar swap loophole. I can take an hour out of my day and get 85-100 chests doing this, something someone with poor motor skills/chronic pain/RSI/etc probably can't do. Even if it's non-essential, I can also understand the frustration of a playing field that doesn't feel level. I can't really think of an even playing field solution that doesn't involve basically as many clicks, just in different ways. The closest I could think is making hitting enter/space be able to close the loot window, allowing one hand to close the window and the other to stay in position over the familiar list. Would they do this? Probably not.

Drudenkreuz

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December 29, 2023 16:55:15

wishbonewarren wrote on 2023-12-29 13:44:35:

I'm curious why so many responses are focusing on whether familiar bonding is essential to the game. Does that mean more essential features (like coli) should be less challenging & complex? (That seems backwards.) Or just that it isn't worth the resources to rework nonessential features?

I was wondering this too. I actually get where OP is coming from here: there is a clear bit of privilege when it comes to taking advantage of the familiar swap loophole. I can take an hour out of my day and get 85-100 chests doing this, something someone with poor motor skills/chronic pain/RSI/etc probably can't do. Even if it's non-essential, I can also understand the frustration of a playing field that doesn't feel level.

I can't really think of an even playing field solution that doesn't involve basically as many clicks, just in different ways. The closest I could think is making hitting enter/space be able to close the loot window, allowing one hand to close the window and the other to stay in position over the familiar list.

Would they do this? Probably not.

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[quote name="wishbonewarren" date="2023-12-29 13:44:35" ] I'm curious why so many responses are focusing on whether familiar bonding is essential to the game. Does that mean more essential features (like coli) should be less challenging & complex? (That seems backwards.) Or just that it isn't worth the resources to rework nonessential features? [/quote] Well I think it's because... you don't have to do it. If it's too much effort to swap out every single familiar – which I imagine it must be for the vast majority of people, I've never seriously considered doing it – you don't really miss out on much, if anything at all. And I wouldn't really say that the coliseum is essential either, it depends how you play. That said, I'd like a Fiona-style page of paired familiars like others have mentioned. Like some sort of toggle when viewing the lair that switches dragons to their familiars or something?

Cazrel

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December 29, 2023 17:28:10

wishbonewarren wrote on 2023-12-29 13:44:35:

I'm curious why so many responses are focusing on whether familiar bonding is essential to the game. Does that mean more essential features (like coli) should be less challenging & complex? (That seems backwards.) Or just that it isn't worth the resources to rework nonessential features?

Well I think it's because... you don't have to do it. If it's too much effort to swap out every single familiar – which I imagine it must be for the vast majority of people, I've never seriously considered doing it – you don't really miss out on much, if anything at all.

And I wouldn't really say that the coliseum is essential either, it depends how you play.

That said, I'd like a Fiona-style page of paired familiars like others have mentioned. Like some sort of toggle when viewing the lair that switches dragons to their familiars or something?

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Lorwolf has a good solution to this- you can click a button and bond all of the familiar-equivalents on your wolves, but it costs a scaling amount of moneys based on how many wolves you have, and also familiars on cooldown can't be taken off wolves ~~a feature I actually really dislike, but worth mentioning in this context~~.

I feel like something like that would be a good compromise? As far as the familiar-swapping things go, maybe it's a babysitter NPC who can be hired to take care of your unequipped fams (but it costs double compared to equipped ones).

I should note that Lorwolf's system still usually lets you make a profit, it's just like... it costs 2500 treasure-equivalent and you get 3000 back and assorted trinkets. It's still worth it, just, there is a significant convenience fee, which I think is ok.

Renaiwom

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December 29, 2023 18:51:58

Lorwolf has a good solution to this- you can click a button and bond all of the familiar-equivalents on your wolves, but it costs a scaling amount of moneys based on how many wolves you have, and also familiars on cooldown can't be taken off wolves ~~a feature I actually really dislike, but worth mentioning in this context~~.

I feel like something like that would be a good compromise? As far as the familiar-swapping things go, maybe it's a babysitter NPC who can be hired to take care of your unequipped fams (but it costs double compared to equipped ones).

I should note that Lorwolf's system still usually lets you make a profit, it's just like... it costs 2500 treasure-equivalent and you get 3000 back and assorted trinkets. It's still worth it, just, there is a significant convenience fee, which I think is ok.

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[quote name="wishbonewarren" date="2023-12-29 13:44:35" ] I'm curious why so many responses are focusing on whether familiar bonding is essential to the game. Does that mean more essential features (like coli) should be less challenging & complex? (That seems backwards.) Or just that it isn't worth the resources to rework nonessential features? [/quote] I think part of it is because of the "disabilities" rationale. In the US, reasonable accomodations have to be provided, for example, for employees to be able to do their job - but not every accomodation is "reasonable." If an employee wanted accomodation to do something that wasn't part of their job, then that wouldn't be reasonable. I'm not sure if that's [i]why[/i] people focus on the necessity of a thing even though we're all players, not employees, but that might be part of it. Because a suggestion with "disability" in the title is essentially seeking accomodation. So part of the suggestion is that the accomodation is necessary to play the game. I hope that answered the question. Labeling an accomodation as something that makes something easy and simple is kinda... eeh. Accomodations don't have to make the game play itself - in fact, I'd call that anything but an accomodation. Even though I might need some help to do certain other things (none of which can be captured in anything on FR at this point), I would never want the experience to be made easier and simpler for me. I'd want to have a chance to experience the same challenge and complexity, just hopefully with a different method of accessing it. Because this is a game. It's supposed to be, in some way, like that. So is accomodation in bonding familiars necessary to play the game? No. Totally not. Few things are. But accomodation is necessary to play that part of the game. But, in my opinion, a bond-all is not an accomodation allowing that part of the game to be played. It's allowing that part to be bypassed, which isn't what game accomodations should do. Providing other methods of familiar bonding (that include actually bonding with each familiar, such as with a spread like what Fiona provides) that keep the overall feel of bonding (and challenge of, I dunno, maintaining interest for that long) would be welcome to me. But never a bond-all. EDIT: I should add: there are some disabilities that make accomodations for certain types of activities pretty much impossible. That's unfortunate. But it's just the nature of some activities. The Fiona-spread of familiars obviously isn't going to work for everyone. But if it is accessible to as many people as possible while still maintaining the part that makes it a challenging game... then obviously that's the best case scenario.

Almedha

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December 29, 2023 18:52:58

wishbonewarren wrote on 2023-12-29 13:44:35:

I'm curious why so many responses are focusing on whether familiar bonding is essential to the game. Does that mean more essential features (like coli) should be less challenging & complex? (That seems backwards.) Or just that it isn't worth the resources to rework nonessential features?

I think part of it is because of the "disabilities" rationale. In the US, reasonable accomodations have to be provided, for example, for employees to be able to do their job - but not every accomodation is "reasonable." If an employee wanted accomodation to do something that wasn't part of their job, then that wouldn't be reasonable.

I'm not sure if that's why people focus on the necessity of a thing even though we're all players, not employees, but that might be part of it. Because a suggestion with "disability" in the title is essentially seeking accomodation. So part of the suggestion is that the accomodation is necessary to play the game.

I hope that answered the question. Labeling an accomodation as something that makes something easy and simple is kinda... eeh. Accomodations don't have to make the game play itself - in fact, I'd call that anything but an accomodation. Even though I might need some help to do certain other things (none of which can be captured in anything on FR at this point), I would never want the experience to be made easier and simpler for me. I'd want to have a chance to experience the same challenge and complexity, just hopefully with a different method of accessing it. Because this is a game. It's supposed to be, in some way, like that.

So is accomodation in bonding familiars necessary to play the game? No. Totally not. Few things are. But accomodation is necessary to play that part of the game. But, in my opinion, a bond-all is not an accomodation allowing that part of the game to be played. It's allowing that part to be bypassed, which isn't what game accomodations should do.

Providing other methods of familiar bonding (that include actually bonding with each familiar, such as with a spread like what Fiona provides) that keep the overall feel of bonding (and challenge of, I dunno, maintaining interest for that long) would be welcome to me. But never a bond-all.

EDIT:
I should add: there are some disabilities that make accomodations for certain types of activities pretty much impossible. That's unfortunate. But it's just the nature of some activities. The Fiona-spread of familiars obviously isn't going to work for everyone. But if it is accessible to as many people as possible while still maintaining the part that makes it a challenging game... then obviously that's the best case scenario.

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I think what might be ideal, is rather than switching, you can have an extra button that says switch with random familiar when you do bond with a familiar. You'd still need to click that button, but that might be helpful for those who do want to bond with fams more easily? Keeps it to one window, you still have to click, but there's less switching, which is the real pain.

All in for a Fiona style page with attached familiars. If there's been steps to make Coli more accessible, then there should be some steps to make other features more accessible.

Vissyn

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December 29, 2023 19:03:33

I think what might be ideal, is rather than switching, you can have an extra button that says switch with random familiar when you do bond with a familiar. You'd still need to click that button, but that might be helpful for those who do want to bond with fams more easily? Keeps it to one window, you still have to click, but there's less switching, which is the real pain.

All in for a Fiona style page with attached familiars. If there's been steps to make Coli more accessible, then there should be some steps to make other features more accessible.

Please don't quote me.

[quote name="Cazrel"] Well I think it's because... you don't have to do it. If it's too much effort to swap out every single familiar – which I imagine it must be for the vast majority of people, I've never seriously considered doing it – you don't really miss out on much, if anything at all. [/quote] If the benefits are negligible, then what would be the negative impact of expediting the bonding process? (Not necessarily a bond-all button, but any number of other possible reworks) If page reloads/ad revenue could be made up through alternate clicking methods (big fan of the [url=https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/sug/3302812]fiona's bonding pen[/url] pitch), then it seems like the only other major impact is saving player time and increasing player enjoyment. There's obviously a significant group of people who disagree with that, so what am I missing? /gen [quote name="Cazrel"] And I wouldn't really say that the coliseum is essential either, it depends how you play. [/quote] "Essential" in a gooey game theory sort of definition! I should have used more precise language but I lack the words. As soon as any item is a coliseum exclusive, it is necessary for [i]some[/i] players to play in the coliseum. (It is not necessary for every player, because this is a social/bartering game.) If nobody fights in the coliseum, we don't have access to a good chunk of food/materials/apparel/familiars/trinkets. (For example, because Swipp's has exclusive items, Swipp's is an essential part of the game, and economy for the exclusive items would suffer if it was unusually difficult to use. Because Tomo's offers treasure, it is not an essential part of the game because there are many alternative places to earn her rewards.) [quote name="Drudenkreuz"] I was wondering this too. I actually get where OP is coming from here: there is a clear bit of privilege when it comes to taking advantage of the familiar swap loophole. I can take an hour out of my day and get 85-100 chests doing this, something someone with poor motor skills/chronic pain/RSI/etc probably can't do. Even if it's non-essential, I can also understand the frustration of a playing field that doesn't feel level. I can't really think of an even playing field solution that doesn't involve basically as many clicks, just in different ways. The closest I could think is making hitting enter/space be able to close the loot window, allowing one hand to close the window and the other to stay in position over the familiar list. [/quote] We can use arrow keys to pan through dragons right now. What if we could go into "familiar mode" and use the arrow keys to pan through a dragon's familiars? It would basically turn into the equivalent of having enough dragons in your lair to match your familiar count. (Now I want to make a mock-up... I kinda like that...) [quote=Almedha] I'm not sure if that's why people focus on the necessity of a thing even though we're all players, not employees, but that might be part of it. Because a suggestion with "disability" in the title is essentially seeking accomodation. So part of the suggestion is that the accomodation is necessary to play the game. I hope that answered the question. Labeling an accomodation as something that makes something easy and simple is kinda... eeh. Accomodations don't have to make the game play itself - in fact, I'd call that anything but an accomodation. Even though I might need some help to do certain other things (none of which can be captured in anything on FR at this point), I would never want the experience to be made easier and simpler for me. I'd want to have a chance to experience the same challenge and complexity, just hopefully with a different method of accessing it. Because this is a game. It's supposed to be, in some way, like that. [/quote] That does make sense, thanks! :) I hadn't thought about it like that. I agree that having challenge and things to DO is part of the point of why we're here at all. I guess it immediately got me thinking about, like... why do we have it set up like this in the first place? People don't seem to be having fun. Disabilities negatively impacting experience can sometimes indicate places where suboptimal game design decisions have been made. (Like a gameplay canary.) I don't see it as a demand, but perhaps a flag indicating there might be something that needs a closer look. [quote] Providing other methods of familiar bonding (that include actually bonding with each familiar, such as with a spread like what Fiona provides) that keep the overall feel of bonding (and challenge of, I dunno, maintaining interest for that long) would be welcome to me. But never a bond-all.[/quote] Because bond-all removes the challenge/game part of the activity? /gen

wishbonewarren

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December 29, 2023 19:40:16

Cazrel wrote:

Well I think it's because... you don't have to do it. If it's too much effort to swap out every single familiar – which I imagine it must be for the vast majority of people, I've never seriously considered doing it – you don't really miss out on much, if anything at all.

If the benefits are negligible, then what would be the negative impact of expediting the bonding process? (Not necessarily a bond-all button, but any number of other possible reworks) If page reloads/ad revenue could be made up through alternate clicking methods (big fan of the fiona's bonding pen pitch), then it seems like the only other major impact is saving player time and increasing player enjoyment.

There's obviously a significant group of people who disagree with that, so what am I missing? /gen

Cazrel wrote:

And I wouldn't really say that the coliseum is essential either, it depends how you play.

"Essential" in a gooey game theory sort of definition! I should have used more precise language but I lack the words.

As soon as any item is a coliseum exclusive, it is necessary for some players to play in the coliseum. (It is not necessary for every player, because this is a social/bartering game.) If nobody fights in the coliseum, we don't have access to a good chunk of food/materials/apparel/familiars/trinkets. (For example, because Swipp's has exclusive items, Swipp's is an essential part of the game, and economy for the exclusive items would suffer if it was unusually difficult to use. Because Tomo's offers treasure, it is not an essential part of the game because there are many alternative places to earn her rewards.)

Drudenkreuz wrote:

I was wondering this too. I actually get where OP is coming from here: there is a clear bit of privilege when it comes to taking advantage of the familiar swap loophole. I can take an hour out of my day and get 85-100 chests doing this, something someone with poor motor skills/chronic pain/RSI/etc probably can't do. Even if it's non-essential, I can also understand the frustration of a playing field that doesn't feel level.

I can't really think of an even playing field solution that doesn't involve basically as many clicks, just in different ways. The closest I could think is making hitting enter/space be able to close the loot window, allowing one hand to close the window and the other to stay in position over the familiar list.

We can use arrow keys to pan through dragons right now. What if we could go into "familiar mode" and use the arrow keys to pan through a dragon's familiars? It would basically turn into the equivalent of having enough dragons in your lair to match your familiar count. (Now I want to make a mock-up... I kinda like that...)

Almedha wrote:

I'm not sure if that's why people focus on the necessity of a thing even though we're all players, not employees, but that might be part of it. Because a suggestion with "disability" in the title is essentially seeking accomodation. So part of the suggestion is that the accomodation is necessary to play the game.

I hope that answered the question. Labeling an accomodation as something that makes something easy and simple is kinda... eeh. Accomodations don't have to make the game play itself - in fact, I'd call that anything but an accomodation. Even though I might need some help to do certain other things (none of which can be captured in anything on FR at this point), I would never want the experience to be made easier and simpler for me. I'd want to have a chance to experience the same challenge and complexity, just hopefully with a different method of accessing it. Because this is a game. It's supposed to be, in some way, like that.

That does make sense, thanks! :) I hadn't thought about it like that. I agree that having challenge and things to DO is part of the point of why we're here at all.

I guess it immediately got me thinking about, like... why do we have it set up like this in the first place? People don't seem to be having fun. Disabilities negatively impacting experience can sometimes indicate places where suboptimal game design decisions have been made. (Like a gameplay canary.) I don't see it as a demand, but perhaps a flag indicating there might be something that needs a closer look.

Quote:

Providing other methods of familiar bonding (that include actually bonding with each familiar, such as with a spread like what Fiona provides) that keep the overall feel of bonding (and challenge of, I dunno, maintaining interest for that long) would be welcome to me. But never a bond-all.

Because bond-all removes the challenge/game part of the activity? /gen

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Last edited on Dec 29, 2023 19:42:11 by wishbonewarren

One of the main issues I have with making things like bonding 'easier' is that, while in the short term, the amount you get is rather negligable, in the long term, it isn't. I have over 1000 familiars. Most of them (if I am counting right, 1053) are awakened. By making it significantly easier to bond with *every* familiar, such that I would be willing to do it every day, I would be adding 52,650 gold every single day (plus any I get from the non-awakened familiars and the extra I get from any fiona familiars) While that might not seem like a lot of gold, it adds up quickly, and when we are talking about a significant portion of the player base (because if it is significantly easier to do, a good portion of the player base will do it), it becomes even more of an issue. Then there is the added issue of that number will only ever grow from here. We get 11 elemental familiars a year, and a multitude of other familiars for the mini-events and NotN. Things like this tend to only widen the gap between new (and extremely casual) players and older (or more dedicated) players, because the older/more dedicated players are going to have more gold, which leads to things increasing in price. This makes it *harder* for people who can only earn money through activities such as bonding or breeding to get the gold needed to buy things. Again, while I am all for trying to make FR be less clicky/grindy, there does need to be a balance. By making it relatively tedious/clicky to do things not necessarily intended (such as bond with 1000+ familiars a day), it discourages that behavior, so that there are natural limits to the amount of treasure that activity adds to the economy. [quote name="wishbonewarren" date="2023-12-29 19:40:16" ] Because bond-all removes the challenge/game part of the activity? /gen [/quote] Most of the reason I don't support a bond all is because of the above, but yeah, it would basically remove any challenge and be the game playing itself (plus, lore wise, since bonding is meant to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan, when bond all is mentioned, all I can imagine is someone going into a room full of cages/familiars, wiggling their fingers and going 'okay, gimme treasure on your way out! Aren't you glad we bonded?!')

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December 29, 2023 20:38:48

One of the main issues I have with making things like bonding 'easier' is that, while in the short term, the amount you get is rather negligable, in the long term, it isn't.

I have over 1000 familiars. Most of them (if I am counting right, 1053) are awakened.

By making it significantly easier to bond with *every* familiar, such that I would be willing to do it every day, I would be adding 52,650 gold every single day (plus any I get from the non-awakened familiars and the extra I get from any fiona familiars)

While that might not seem like a lot of gold, it adds up quickly, and when we are talking about a significant portion of the player base (because if it is significantly easier to do, a good portion of the player base will do it), it becomes even more of an issue.

Then there is the added issue of that number will only ever grow from here. We get 11 elemental familiars a year, and a multitude of other familiars for the mini-events and NotN.

Things like this tend to only widen the gap between new (and extremely casual) players and older (or more dedicated) players, because the older/more dedicated players are going to have more gold, which leads to things increasing in price. This makes it *harder* for people who can only earn money through activities such as bonding or breeding to get the gold needed to buy things.

Again, while I am all for trying to make FR be less clicky/grindy, there does need to be a balance. By making it relatively tedious/clicky to do things not necessarily intended (such as bond with 1000+ familiars a day), it discourages that behavior, so that there are natural limits to the amount of treasure that activity adds to the economy.

wishbonewarren wrote on 2023-12-29 19:40:16:

Because bond-all removes the challenge/game part of the activity? /gen

Most of the reason I don't support a bond all is because of the above, but yeah, it would basically remove any challenge and be the game playing itself (plus, lore wise, since bonding is meant to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan, when bond all is mentioned, all I can imagine is someone going into a room full of cages/familiars, wiggling their fingers and going 'okay, gimme treasure on your way out! Aren't you glad we bonded?!')

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[quote=Jemadar] By making it significantly easier to bond with *every* familiar, such that I would be willing to do it every day, I would be adding 52,650 gold every single day (plus any I get from the non-awakened familiars and the extra I get from any fiona familiars) [...] Things like this tend to only widen the gap between new (and extremely casual) players and older (or more dedicated) players, because the older/more dedicated players are going to have more gold, which leads to things increasing in price. This makes it *harder* for people who can only earn money thro [...] (plus, lore wise, since bonding is meant to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan, when bond all is mentioned, all I can imagine is someone going into a room full of cages/familiars, wiggling their fingers and going 'okay, gimme treasure on your way out! Aren't you glad we bonded?!') [/quote] THIS makes sense. Well said!! Thanks for laying out the numbers (and lore perspective)

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December 29, 2023 20:48:29

Jemadar wrote:

By making it significantly easier to bond with *every* familiar, such that I would be willing to do it every day, I would be adding 52,650 gold every single day (plus any I get from the non-awakened familiars and the extra I get from any fiona familiars)
[...]
Things like this tend to only widen the gap between new (and extremely casual) players and older (or more dedicated) players, because the older/more dedicated players are going to have more gold, which leads to things increasing in price. This makes it *harder* for people who can only earn money thro
[...]
(plus, lore wise, since bonding is meant to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan, when bond all is mentioned, all I can imagine is someone going into a room full of cages/familiars, wiggling their fingers and going 'okay, gimme treasure on your way out! Aren't you glad we bonded?!')

THIS makes sense. Well said!! Thanks for laying out the numbers (and lore perspective)

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As a disabled person, massive support for some kind of QoL update to familiar bonding. I've got mental disorders which make it so that I feel incredibly wrong if I don't bond with EVERY familiar I have every day. This has become a huge task as I've amounted more and more familiars and the opening two tabs thing works for a certain amount of them, but I'm finding myself with less and less time and physical ability to do them all every day, which is incredibly distressing. I do have quite a few issues with the way familiar bonding and disabilities have been talked about in this thread. "Familiar bonding is not an essential part of the game"/"its a bonus if you want to do it"/"you can make millions without it" etc. That's a super garbage take, honestly. When you're disabled, it's no longer a, "If you want to do it, it's a nice little bonus." Because if its super draining/hard for a disabled person to do, then it removes that aspect from the game for them entirely, even if they WANT to do it. So basically what you're saying by saying its "not required" and "is a bonus" is: "If you're able-bodied enough to do it, you can have a nice bonus. Good job for not being too disabled to partake in this aspect of the game." -- "It removes challenge" What challenge??? Its clicking buttons over and over again. It's not like it's a fun little game that removes complexity by adding a button that bonds with multiple familiars. The way this is phrased is like somebody is suggesting we add a, "Let's just have a button you can click to auto-complete all of the minigames so you can just get 75kT free without having to play any minigames." There's no familiar bonding minigame. It's just tedious button-clicking, which is [i]only[/i] a challenge to disabled people. Its [i]tedious[/i] to able-bodied people. -- I really liked the idea of a "Familiar Bonding" page in the beastiary, where it cycles through every [i]owned[/i] familiar and there's a little "bond" button on the bottom (keeps ad revenue per page? if that's important?) so while you still have to click through, its more like clicking through the arrow buttons on your dragons? (Which is plausible for me to do, personally. Idk about other disabilities.) [quote=Jemadar]Most of the reason I don't support a bond all is because of the above, but yeah, it would basically remove any challenge and be the game playing itself (plus, lore wise, since bonding is meant to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan, when bond all is mentioned, all I can imagine is someone going into a room full of cages/familiars, wiggling their fingers and going 'okay, gimme treasure on your way out! Aren't you glad we bonded?!')[/quote] Maybe to make it lore-friendly, you can assign a dragon to the "familiar room" and its kind of like the dragon is running a familiar care center for all of the ones not attached to dragons. (Not for a bond-all, but for the idea of a familiar room where you cycle through each familiar with an arrow key and a bond button) I guess I also don't see swapping out the familiar on one dragon repeatedly and pressing the "bond" button very lore-friendly, if bonding with familiars is supposed to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan. I can make a very similar correlation, it feels like someone going, "Alright everyone! Get in a single file line. Everybody gets 1 second with the dragon! Don't forget to empty your pockets on the way out!" And yet its a part of the game anyway. So I find "Lore!!" to be a very poor argument against a bond-all (Since lore is not respected in not adding familiar swapping cool-down timers and such. If it was not intended to that degree, to where you weren't "supposed to", then I would imagine that the FR Devs would have added something to prevent quickly swapping between familiars) Anyway, if it must be lore-friendly, I think having an assigned dragon to a "familiar room" would add a lot more lore potential for people who like that kind of stuff, and make bonding easier. This makes it feel like this dragon is actively taking care of all of the familiars in the "pen" (/inventory?). I never liked that familiars in the inventory are just.. hanging out? In stasis? Not doing anything? Where [i]is[/i] the inventory? Who is feeding/supervising them?? Are they okay??? -- Sort-of alternatively, but more of the same idea just edited a bit: What about a page, like the lair, where you have "slots" for familiars. And you assign your un-bonded familiars to those slots. You start out with 5 free slots, and then you pay treasure to unlock more slots (just like in the dragon lair). Maybe it only unlocks after you have like, 25 (more?) familiars. There could be a "bond all" in this page, or not, I'd prefer if there was since you're paying for it and it's limited, but it'd still be easy (for me, at least) to click through each familiar. Maybe they have two ways of doing it, like both a familiar "page" and a bond button underneath each one (like Fiona's) so you can pick what method you wanna do. If there is a bond-all button, then once you assign a familiar there, you should not be able to remove it for like 30 days or something? Or once you take it out you can't put it back in for 30 days. Kind of like the Hibernal Den? So that way you can't just put 5 in, bond-all, take them out, put 5 more in, repeat. Or if you have the patience to do so, you can only do it every 30 days lol. This does a few things: 1: Does not allow people who have 1,000+ familiars to immediately "bond all" their familiars to gain 50kT+ daily. If they end up with this privilege its because they paid for all of the slots to do so. 2: Adds incentive to buy slots/provides another treasure sink. (could also be gems if economy needs a gem sink?) 3: Is entirely optional, and provides ease of access for disabled people while allowing the same bonding methods to remain in place for the normal dragon lair. 4: Does not remove the "challenge", instead it swaps out the challenge for a different challenge (gathering the treasure/gems to unlock new slots to bond-all your assigned familiars, vs clicking on each familiar every day.) The one issue is that I feel like with this method, it locks accommodation behind a challenge/paywall. Like you have to jump through hoops to get accessible familiar bonding. I suppose in some ways, accessibility features are going to be broken for everyday players, so the challenge is finding something that makes it accessible without making it broken. Sometimes that means adding a different challenge. -- Another general suggestion: If the Fiona's Method is added, a hotkey on the keyboard to close the rewards thing. Moving the mouse to close it is annoying and sometimes painful/too much wrist movement. Something like hitting the spacebar to close the rewards popup could work.

FinalAbsolution

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December 31, 2023 18:17:54

As a disabled person, massive support for some kind of QoL update to familiar bonding.

I've got mental disorders which make it so that I feel incredibly wrong if I don't bond with EVERY familiar I have every day. This has become a huge task as I've amounted more and more familiars and the opening two tabs thing works for a certain amount of them, but I'm finding myself with less and less time and physical ability to do them all every day, which is incredibly distressing.

I do have quite a few issues with the way familiar bonding and disabilities have been talked about in this thread.

"Familiar bonding is not an essential part of the game"/"its a bonus if you want to do it"/"you can make millions without it" etc.

That's a super garbage take, honestly. When you're disabled, it's no longer a, "If you want to do it, it's a nice little bonus." Because if its super draining/hard for a disabled person to do, then it removes that aspect from the game for them entirely, even if they WANT to do it. So basically what you're saying by saying its
"not required" and "is a bonus" is:
"If you're able-bodied enough to do it, you can have a nice bonus. Good job for not being too disabled to partake in this aspect of the game."

--

"It removes challenge"

What challenge??? Its clicking buttons over and over again. It's not like it's a fun little game that removes complexity by adding a button that bonds with multiple familiars. The way this is phrased is like somebody is suggesting we add a, "Let's just have a button you can click to auto-complete all of the minigames so you can just get 75kT free without having to play any minigames." There's no familiar bonding minigame. It's just tedious button-clicking, which is only a challenge to disabled people. Its tedious to able-bodied people.

--

I really liked the idea of a "Familiar Bonding" page in the beastiary, where it cycles through every owned familiar and there's a little "bond" button on the bottom (keeps ad revenue per page? if that's important?) so while you still have to click through, its more like clicking through the arrow buttons on your dragons? (Which is plausible for me to do, personally. Idk about other disabilities.)

Jemadar wrote:

Most of the reason I don't support a bond all is because of the above, but yeah, it would basically remove any challenge and be the game playing itself (plus, lore wise, since bonding is meant to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan, when bond all is mentioned, all I can imagine is someone going into a room full of cages/familiars, wiggling their fingers and going 'okay, gimme treasure on your way out! Aren't you glad we bonded?!')

Maybe to make it lore-friendly, you can assign a dragon to the "familiar room" and its kind of like the dragon is running a familiar care center for all of the ones not attached to dragons. (Not for a bond-all, but for the idea of a familiar room where you cycle through each familiar with an arrow key and a bond button)

I guess I also don't see swapping out the familiar on one dragon repeatedly and pressing the "bond" button very lore-friendly, if bonding with familiars is supposed to be a dragon bonding with a particular familiar on behalf of the clan.

I can make a very similar correlation, it feels like someone going,
"Alright everyone! Get in a single file line. Everybody gets 1 second with the dragon! Don't forget to empty your pockets on the way out!"

And yet its a part of the game anyway. So I find "Lore!!" to be a very poor argument against a bond-all (Since lore is not respected in not adding familiar swapping cool-down timers and such. If it was not intended to that degree, to where you weren't "supposed to", then I would imagine that the FR Devs would have added something to prevent quickly swapping between familiars)

Anyway, if it must be lore-friendly, I think having an assigned dragon to a "familiar room" would add a lot more lore potential for people who like that kind of stuff, and make bonding easier. This makes it feel like this dragon is actively taking care of all of the familiars in the "pen" (/inventory?). I never liked that familiars in the inventory are just.. hanging out? In stasis? Not doing anything? Where is the inventory? Who is feeding/supervising them?? Are they okay???

--

Sort-of alternatively, but more of the same idea just edited a bit:

What about a page, like the lair, where you have "slots" for familiars. And you assign your un-bonded familiars to those slots. You start out with 5 free slots, and then you pay treasure to unlock more slots (just like in the dragon lair).

Maybe it only unlocks after you have like, 25 (more?) familiars.

There could be a "bond all" in this page, or not, I'd prefer if there was since you're paying for it and it's limited, but it'd still be easy (for me, at least) to click through each familiar. Maybe they have two ways of doing it, like both a familiar "page" and a bond button underneath each one (like Fiona's) so you can pick what method you wanna do.

If there is a bond-all button, then once you assign a familiar there, you should not be able to remove it for like 30 days or something? Or once you take it out you can't put it back in for 30 days. Kind of like the Hibernal Den? So that way you can't just put 5 in, bond-all, take them out, put 5 more in, repeat. Or if you have the patience to do so, you can only do it every 30 days lol.

This does a few things:

1: Does not allow people who have 1,000+ familiars to immediately "bond all" their familiars to gain 50kT+ daily. If they end up with this privilege its because they paid for all of the slots to do so.

2: Adds incentive to buy slots/provides another treasure sink. (could also be gems if economy needs a gem sink?)

3: Is entirely optional, and provides ease of access for disabled people while allowing the same bonding methods to remain in place for the normal dragon lair.

4: Does not remove the "challenge", instead it swaps out the challenge for a different challenge (gathering the treasure/gems to unlock new slots to bond-all your assigned familiars, vs clicking on each familiar every day.)

The one issue is that I feel like with this method, it locks accommodation behind a challenge/paywall. Like you have to jump through hoops to get accessible familiar bonding. I suppose in some ways, accessibility features are going to be broken for everyday players, so the challenge is finding something that makes it accessible without making it broken. Sometimes that means adding a different challenge.

--

Another general suggestion:

If the Fiona's Method is added, a hotkey on the keyboard to close the rewards thing. Moving the mouse to close it is annoying and sometimes painful/too much wrist movement. Something like hitting the spacebar to close the rewards popup could work.