@
Sopheroo
Please see the rest of my post about not supporting the notion and ping me next time you're speaking to me, thank you.
@
Sopheroo
Please see the rest of my post about not supporting the notion and ping me next time you're speaking to me, thank you.
Ping me to get my attention!
[quote name="corprus" date="2019-04-16 02:26:02" ]
at the very least, eliminates should drop in all venues. with all the people grinding fodder in the mire, elims would become at least a bit more reasonable to obtain
[/quote]
This.
Though I don't believe it pays for itself in any realistic way. That's like saying you can pay for an eliminate with Fairgrounds games. Yes, okay, you [i]can[/i], but is it reasonable to expect a newbie to grind for that? For six days in a row? For one stone? When they probably want several? No. Eliminate has never dropped for me, and I spend my time in the Coliseum almost exclusively in the Mire.
corprus wrote on 2019-04-16 02:26:02:
at the very least, eliminates should drop in all venues. with all the people grinding fodder in the mire, elims would become at least a bit more reasonable to obtain
This.
Though I don't believe it pays for itself in any realistic way. That's like saying you can pay for an eliminate with Fairgrounds games. Yes, okay, you
can, but is it reasonable to expect a newbie to grind for that? For six days in a row? For one stone? When they probably want several? No. Eliminate has never dropped for me, and I spend my time in the Coliseum almost exclusively in the Mire.
@
chlorr
This was the only relevant point I had to mention - I had no desire to comment on the rest of your post, because it's not important to the things I did want to mention - which is the point you made about inflation.
Inflation isn't random, and doesn't just affect one thing - inflation affects all desirable items, and can be tagged to how easy it is to make treasure. The more treasure people generally have, the less worth one treasure has.
I didn't want to ping you to mention that you need to understand why Eliminates are 550K now, compared to 275K, and it's because treasure globally deflated in the last two years, mostly because of G&G, but also because of Artifracture.
It's a lot easier to get treasure NOW than it was when Eliminate was 275K. Or 50K.
Another thing that causes inflation is exalt-training! That's right - People who already own one or several Eliminate contribute to the inflation by exalt-training and producing treasure with no sunken cost (aside from AH tax)
tldr, 550K IS the price adjusted to inflation. Things in general about doubled in price in the last 36 months.
@
toxa
Then, maybe we should tell newbies more than they don't need more than one Eliminate, you can absolutely grind either with a single trainer (Mire Flyer) or fill the other slot with a cleric (which is helpful in Golem Workshop)
I have a single Eliminate user and I am swimming in money and good drops :D
@
chlorr
This was the only relevant point I had to mention - I had no desire to comment on the rest of your post, because it's not important to the things I did want to mention - which is the point you made about inflation.
Inflation isn't random, and doesn't just affect one thing - inflation affects all desirable items, and can be tagged to how easy it is to make treasure. The more treasure people generally have, the less worth one treasure has.
I didn't want to ping you to mention that you need to understand why Eliminates are 550K now, compared to 275K, and it's because treasure globally deflated in the last two years, mostly because of G&G, but also because of Artifracture.
It's a lot easier to get treasure NOW than it was when Eliminate was 275K. Or 50K.
Another thing that causes inflation is exalt-training! That's right - People who already own one or several Eliminate contribute to the inflation by exalt-training and producing treasure with no sunken cost (aside from AH tax)
tldr, 550K IS the price adjusted to inflation. Things in general about doubled in price in the last 36 months.
@
toxa
Then, maybe we should tell newbies more than they don't need more than one Eliminate, you can absolutely grind either with a single trainer (Mire Flyer) or fill the other slot with a cleric (which is helpful in Golem Workshop)
I have a single Eliminate user and I am swimming in money and good drops :D
support for eliminate being added as a drop to all venues
makes no sense imo that two? venues are left out.
I kinda like the idea of getting one free once your progen dragon hits level X. Make it into a new item called Clanbound Eliminate, which can only be giving to either of your progen dragons. And you can't sell/trade it away as it's bound into your account.
I kinda like the idea of getting one free once your progen dragon hits level X. Make it into a new item called Clanbound Eliminate, which can only be giving to either of your progen dragons. And you can't sell/trade it away as it's bound into your account.
[quote name="Toxa" date="2019-04-17 03:03:10" ]
[quote name="corprus" date="2019-04-16 02:26:02" ]
at the very least, eliminates should drop in all venues. with all the people grinding fodder in the mire, elims would become at least a bit more reasonable to obtain
[/quote]
This.
Though I don't believe it pays for itself in any realistic way. That's like saying you can pay for an eliminate with Fairgrounds games. Yes, okay, you [i]can[/i], but is it reasonable to expect a newbie to grind for that? For six days in a row? For one stone? When they probably want several? No. Eliminate has never dropped for me, and I spend my time in the Coliseum almost exclusively in the Mire.
[/quote]
how would it not pay for itself in a realistic way? I barely do the coliseum, except for festival weeks, and the occasional 'lets train these dragons' moods, and any eliminate I would have had to buy has paid for itself long since. Even if it was just by saving me money because I don't have to buy festival skins because I get the chests. However, there are also egg drops, fodder training and other items that can be sold.
Also, it absolutely is reasonable to expect a new player to have to grind for an end game type stone that is vastly overpowered. Or really for anything they really want. I do think eliminates should drop in all venues and are probably somewhat overpriced, but I also don't believe that users should be able to get them within the first two days of their being on site. (unless they were gifted) (also, since the mire is one of the venues that doesn't have it, that is why it has never dropped for you. I got my two eliminates in the Scorched forest and the Boreal woods)
To be honest, and I have said this before, I think the guides for the coliseum tend to do new players a disservice. Most of them are so focused on fodder training and getting your first eliminate and getting to the mire, that they don't bother to tell the new players that it absolutely CAN be profitable to grind lower levels, even without an eliminate. Once a player gets their dragons to where they can one scratch enemies in the woodland path, then they can simply keep doing that, with the bonus chance of getting an eliminate. Is it boring? Sure, but so is fodder training in the same venue.
It also gives new players the impression that you *cannot* use the coliseum past a certain point without an eliminate.
This feeds into the demand for eliminate, which, since eliminate is a rare drop, raises the price for it.
Toxa wrote on 2019-04-17 03:03:10:
corprus wrote on 2019-04-16 02:26:02:
at the very least, eliminates should drop in all venues. with all the people grinding fodder in the mire, elims would become at least a bit more reasonable to obtain
This.
Though I don't believe it pays for itself in any realistic way. That's like saying you can pay for an eliminate with Fairgrounds games. Yes, okay, you
can, but is it reasonable to expect a newbie to grind for that? For six days in a row? For one stone? When they probably want several? No. Eliminate has never dropped for me, and I spend my time in the Coliseum almost exclusively in the Mire.
how would it not pay for itself in a realistic way? I barely do the coliseum, except for festival weeks, and the occasional 'lets train these dragons' moods, and any eliminate I would have had to buy has paid for itself long since. Even if it was just by saving me money because I don't have to buy festival skins because I get the chests. However, there are also egg drops, fodder training and other items that can be sold.
Also, it absolutely is reasonable to expect a new player to have to grind for an end game type stone that is vastly overpowered. Or really for anything they really want. I do think eliminates should drop in all venues and are probably somewhat overpriced, but I also don't believe that users should be able to get them within the first two days of their being on site. (unless they were gifted) (also, since the mire is one of the venues that doesn't have it, that is why it has never dropped for you. I got my two eliminates in the Scorched forest and the Boreal woods)
To be honest, and I have said this before, I think the guides for the coliseum tend to do new players a disservice. Most of them are so focused on fodder training and getting your first eliminate and getting to the mire, that they don't bother to tell the new players that it absolutely CAN be profitable to grind lower levels, even without an eliminate. Once a player gets their dragons to where they can one scratch enemies in the woodland path, then they can simply keep doing that, with the bonus chance of getting an eliminate. Is it boring? Sure, but so is fodder training in the same venue.
It also gives new players the impression that you *cannot* use the coliseum past a certain point without an eliminate.
This feeds into the demand for eliminate, which, since eliminate is a rare drop, raises the price for it.
[quote name="Toxa" date="2019-04-17 03:03:10" ]
Though I don't believe it pays for itself in any realistic way. That's like saying you can pay for an eliminate with Fairgrounds games. Yes, okay, you [i]can[/i], but is it reasonable to expect a newbie to grind for that? For six days in a row? For one stone? When they probably want several? No. Eliminate has never dropped for me, and I spend my time in the Coliseum almost exclusively in the Mire.
[/quote]
I think it's far more reasonable to expect players to earn the funds needed to buy a stone versus giving them one for free personally.
Eliminates do not drop in the Mire, so it makes sense that one has never dropped for you if that is where you spend your Coliseum time...
Toxa wrote on 2019-04-17 03:03:10:
Though I don't believe it pays for itself in any realistic way. That's like saying you can pay for an eliminate with Fairgrounds games. Yes, okay, you can, but is it reasonable to expect a newbie to grind for that? For six days in a row? For one stone? When they probably want several? No. Eliminate has never dropped for me, and I spend my time in the Coliseum almost exclusively in the Mire.
I think it's far more reasonable to expect players to earn the funds needed to buy a stone versus giving them one for free personally.
Eliminates do not drop in the Mire, so it makes sense that one has never dropped for you if that is where you spend your Coliseum time...
@
Sopheroo
I had no idea that inflation had gotten that bad, though I am well and fully aware that inflation is not selective and of how inflation in fact operates, because I generally don't use the AH beyond purchasing fodder and fodder prices haven't intensely increased (a couple thousand treasure isn't terribly noteworthy to me when the prices can vary so wildly during dom pushes, battles, and profit pushes).
In the future, when addressing things that I say, please ping me in order to politely correct any incorrect things I say based on simple misconceptions. It comes across poorly otherwise.
@
Sopheroo
I had no idea that inflation had gotten that bad, though I am well and fully aware that inflation is not selective and of how inflation in fact operates, because I generally don't use the AH beyond purchasing fodder and fodder prices haven't intensely increased (a couple thousand treasure isn't terribly noteworthy to me when the prices can vary so wildly during dom pushes, battles, and profit pushes).
In the future, when addressing things that I say, please ping me in order to politely correct any incorrect things I say based on simple misconceptions. It comes across poorly otherwise.
Ping me to get my attention!
No support, I scrounged and saved for my first Elim (which I grabbed off the AH for about 400g I think when I first joined two years ago) and it honestly didn't take too long even just with Artifracture as the best option.
Now it's easier than ever to earn treasure from Glimmer and Gloom, you can get your first Elim by maxing the Fairgrounds for a week and watching the AH for cheap ones.
I'd like to add there ARE cheap ones posted periodically, I grabbed one myself for 100 off two weeks ago and saw one at 550 the other day.
You gotta put in some work if you want to succeed, not everything's gonna be handed to you.
No support, I scrounged and saved for my first Elim (which I grabbed off the AH for about 400g I think when I first joined two years ago) and it honestly didn't take too long even just with Artifracture as the best option.
Now it's easier than ever to earn treasure from Glimmer and Gloom, you can get your first Elim by maxing the Fairgrounds for a week and watching the AH for cheap ones.
I'd like to add there ARE cheap ones posted periodically, I grabbed one myself for 100 off two weeks ago and saw one at 550 the other day.
You gotta put in some work if you want to succeed, not everything's gonna be handed to you.
[quote name="@Sopheroo" date="2019-04-17 03:59:35" ]
Then, maybe we should tell newbies more than they don't need more than one Eliminate, you can absolutely grind either with a single trainer (Mire Flyer) or fill the other slot with a cleric (which is helpful in Golem Workshop)
I have a single Eliminate user and I am swimming in money and good drops :D
[/quote]
That's such a big part of it. If getting one Eliminate seems daunting, thinking you need [b]three[/b] of them would be completely discouraged. I have a number of Eliminate dragons, and I never put more than one on a coli team regardless of venue.
Of course it helps that I can choose between builds, but even a Mire Flyer (or Ruins Raider) without mage/tank support can easily grind most of the lower venues for hours, and with the first turn bug gone, they can also act as BW/CP/HR flyers even if not optimally statted for those venues.
~
Other things that could help the situation:
- Secure dragon lending, allowing users to more confidently allow their stoned dragons to be borrowed by newbies and casual players.
- Publicly-viewable stones, at minimum for dragons posted on the AH, which would promote taking the cheaper route of buying a pre-stoned dragon instead of the Eliminate itself.
(Yes, doing that wouldn't be as much fun as training and stoning your own dragon, but the key is you can buy the ready-made dragon [i]at first[/i], use it to get started earning treasure (and also train those dragons of yours), then sell it on to another user once you have yours ready to go.)
Then, maybe we should tell newbies more than they don't need more than one Eliminate, you can absolutely grind either with a single trainer (Mire Flyer) or fill the other slot with a cleric (which is helpful in Golem Workshop)
I have a single Eliminate user and I am swimming in money and good drops :D
That's such a big part of it. If getting one Eliminate seems daunting, thinking you need
three of them would be completely discouraged. I have a number of Eliminate dragons, and I never put more than one on a coli team regardless of venue.
Of course it helps that I can choose between builds, but even a Mire Flyer (or Ruins Raider) without mage/tank support can easily grind most of the lower venues for hours, and with the first turn bug gone, they can also act as BW/CP/HR flyers even if not optimally statted for those venues.
~
Other things that could help the situation:
- Secure dragon lending, allowing users to more confidently allow their stoned dragons to be borrowed by newbies and casual players.
- Publicly-viewable stones, at minimum for dragons posted on the AH, which would promote taking the cheaper route of buying a pre-stoned dragon instead of the Eliminate itself.
(Yes, doing that wouldn't be as much fun as training and stoning your own dragon, but the key is you can buy the ready-made dragon
at first, use it to get started earning treasure (and also train those dragons of yours), then sell it on to another user once you have yours ready to go.)
