Flight Rising Discussion

[quote name="ColonelChicken" date="2024-06-12 01:54:56" ] [quote name="LunamFlore" date="2024-06-11 18:06:50" ] Offering some speculative perspective here! Judging by the illustrations in "DragonArt: Evolution" [s]and being a fantasy creature art nerd in general[/s] I believe the design trend of large chests and small waists is intentionally done so that these breeds can plausibly fly. A large chest for the massive amount of oxygen needed to power the body, a smaller waist/hind legs that would be less cumbersome for the wings to support. Breeds without the [emoji=rainbow star 2 size=1][b][i]fabulous waist ratio[/i][/b][emoji=rainbow star 2 size=1], such as the snapper, have struggles with flight written into their lore. [/quote] With their tiny squished wings and useless and super heavy hindquarters they wouldn't be able to fly. A big chest and smaller waist would help making them a little lighter, but without a "They fly because of MAGIC" in-universe explanation, there isn't a single breed that I can imagine lifting itself from the ground with the anatomy they have right now. And it's okay ! They're magical beings, there's something wonderful about the idea that a super heavy monster can just go "Screw gravity" and take to the sky with no more trouble than a super light birds with hollow bones. I really like this thread - plenty of fun ideas here. I'm a little confused at the number of people going "Those designs would be too cartoony/stylized" though... Are we pretending Tundra don't have big ol' Disney eyes? Or that Imperials don't have cute cartoon animal faces instead of the fierce, eye-bulging and human-nosed face their inspiration usually have? Most of our recent breeds have that round, cute Petshop face, why are we pretending a dragon with a trunk, funny looking teeth or a rounder belly would look out of place among them? All the designs people have submitted here (and the small edits and little fixes that actually use the site's artwork too) would fit right in with the rest of the breeds we have right now. I'm not holding my breath for any of them to be implemented, but it's still a really nice read. (also imagine how easy it would be to edit whatever-the-eel-breed-is-called to make their heads look like an actual eel. You would just have to move the eye a little and make it rounder. It would 100% make that breed a must have for me, and it would be a 5 pixel fix, max lmao) [/quote] This is baffling to me too. Since when has realism mattered in this site at all lol Also bees exist as do many fat bodied small winged bugs. It's baffling how many people are arguing against more options. Like what do they gain from not wanting more diverse ancients in particular? It strikes me as such a weird attitude to have. "Oh if they released weird dragons they wouldn't be popular therefore that minority of people who would like them shouldn't get them because we don't like it" It's called ignoring things that aren't for you. It's free and easy and I feel like more people on here should try it.

the experience of reading this thread is like finding a local ice cream place that only serves vanilla, suggesting they should maybe expand their offerings, and being met with the following responses: [LIST] [*] why should they? [i]I[/i] like vanilla just fine. [*] i don't really think that other flavours would [i]work[/i] with their particular method of making ice cream, you know? [*] have you considered that other flavours just aren't as popular as vanilla? [*] it's pretty rude to critique their ice cream :/// you're coming off as kinda negative [/LIST] [quote name="hisseefit" date="2024-06-11 12:00:28" ] following up on my thoughts here...i kept thinking about this stuff and it made me reallllly wanna draw some dragons... so i slapped some of the shapes people were suggesting over some existing poses. i saw some people saying bigger shapes dont read well or are harder to pose, and i dont think thats necessarily true. big guys can do any pose the skinny guys can if you put ur mind to it ^^ plus, youd get the added benefit of the primary patterns being bigger and more readable, and bigger details on apparel. i only spent about 10 minutes on each of these, and my anatomy is super rusty, so imagine what the actual art team could do! [img]https://64.media.tumblr.com/78ea0ecec4d77926bbe3bdb0f90c1ffe/d613e4aa2eb93166-a9/s2048x3072/072334302c04c4c25c03692f99f535848d5c5bbb.png[/img] i wonder if people are saying posing big character is bad because of the awkward snapper posing? i think snappers were just drawn before they really knew what worked in a pose...if you draw the snapper in a true 3/4, it looks fine. seems like they wanted the vibe of a 3/4 but with a forced profile view on the torso... they couldn't do a true 3/4, bc you'd lose the wings, and the foreshortening would squish the gene patterns... [img]https://64.media.tumblr.com/fce5a0dae77bae2c1c91ce17589f342b/d613e4aa2eb93166-0c/s1280x1920/3794e3fbde21586f3f9ec986fa2f03cf39239d27.png[/img] but now theyre over a decade in, and have lots of experience with the posing :) i dont think itd be a problem! after playing with it i dont think the undel style is limiting at all, though i didnt go super out there with the shapes. besides the crocodile, just some p generic "big dragon" guys. [/quote] on a more positive note, these are absolutely outstanding! i love how dynamic all of the poses are, and the silhouettes are super clear and readable. i would have any of these designs in my lair in a heartbeat (and i would have 100 of the reposed snappers)

[quote name="Kahvinporo" date="2024-06-12 07:49:10" ] All I really want is an ancient dragon with hooves. [/quote] I am with you there and I will lose it if we finally get one. My wallet will shrivel up and blow away like powder.

[quote name="Sorel" date="2024-06-12 10:14:46" ] [quote name="Kahvinporo" date="2024-06-12 07:49:10" ] All I really want is an ancient dragon with hooves. [/quote] I am with you there and I will lose it if we finally get one. My wallet will shrivel up and blow away like powder. [/quote] YES a hoofed breed really would be everything honestly c:

I'd love cloven hooves like a unicorn or even boar.... I feel like some people might complain its "not a dragon" or whatever but they're so fun

[quote name="pheelthemoment" date="2024-06-12 10:07:17" ] I'm not asking them to churn out ancients faster. I'm asking them to consider the similarity in all the existing ancient's body plans/body types before adding more. We have 9 skinny/"average" ancients, and none that stray from that mold. I would literally be happy if we just had one or two that are fat. Each release has made me feel less hopeful that they will stray from the mold though. I just want my voice to be heard that many of us here would appreciate different body types so that they may consider that for the future. [/quote] I think that's a fair enough point to make. Especially since they have reached the development velocity where they are able to release a new species every 5 months or so.

[quote name="voidsnake" date="2024-06-12 09:51:08" ] [quote name="sixthdoctor" date="2024-06-11 14:36:07" ] [quote name="voidsnake" date="2024-06-11 14:05:57" ] yeah, I feel like a lot of this just comes down to opinion in art style.. a lot of the examples really just look like FR drawings in a cartoony and exaggerated art style. which maybe some people prefer a more exaggerated art style, but it's not a problem with FR's current art, it's just personal preference. the FR breeds are still distinct in the FR art style even if they aren't exaggerated with body type, and plenty of people still do appreciate the existing art style. I think suggestions for more fun dragons and shapes is good, but it feels rude that some of the complaints seem to just be that people think cartoonish and exaggerated art is objectively better than FR art when that's just people's opinions...... [/quote] People aren't saying that the website should be in a different, cartoonier style, they're just showing examples of different body shapes that have dynamic poses and fit within the image size requirements. This is intended solely as a counterargument to people saying stocky or fat dragons can't look dynamic or fit into the image boxes. The drawings don't need to be in the website's house art style to make that point. Just to reiterate, here's a dragon I've edited to be chubbier and have a different face. It isn't more cartoonish or in a different art style, because nothing about FR's art style or image requirements necessitates that the dragon be thin: [img]https://64.media.tumblr.com/3b2240b10234117e0dabd66114e27590/29fc53fee502a404-cb/s400x600/3dcf7e7a84f2b2cf001b6fb9bb6827025fd5d3e3.png[/img] [/quote] yeah, just saying that if the main changes being made to show different body shapes are all using cartoonish proportions and shapes, it's hard to extrapolate what that looks like in FR style and if it's an argument for FR style of those shapes or just FR dragons in cartoonish style also yeah, as I said before... I don't personally see any reason to not have the designs have changes like that to have different body/head shapes, I'm not suggesting that they can't add those body shapes or anything, I just don't see why they should have to. they still don't have actual thin/underweight dragons either even if they have more with large chest-waist ratio, I think it's fine for them to aim for average weights for the breed art. my perspective is just that the breeds are plenty unique as they are, I appreciate all the suggestions for new shapes and inspiration and such, but I don't think it's a problem for them to not choose those specific designs, the process for making new breeds has a LOT of considerations (as have been pointed out by many people in this thread) and I find it rude to criticize the existing art/artists (of course not all of the posts are doing this, but some definitely are) when they could have any number of reasons for making the designs as they are [/quote] Legitimate question here not meant in a mean way at all. What would you lose if they did? What would be taken away from you if the next dragon released was a really different breed? No one is saying they should go back and change any previously released dragons and that art example quoted is just showing that you could still release different body shapes in the fr style. The worst that could happen is you don't like the next breed released and I'm sure lots of people haven't liked previous breeds released so I'm just not sure why you would be against more options if nothing is being taken away? I don't get it.

[quote name="@notecardPasta" date="2024-06-12 10:19:47" ] I'd love cloven hooves like a unicorn or even boar.... I feel like some people might complain its "not a dragon" or whatever but they're so fun [/quote] Dragons are not just western designs. A cockatrice is a dragon. There are far more dragons out there that do not fit the western art. And I would rather see a variety than just western dragons.

[quote name="@Anky" date="2024-06-12 10:22:26" ] Dragons are not just western designs. A cockatrice is a dragon. There are far more dragons out there that do not fit the western art. And I would rather see a variety than just western dragons. [/quote] I agree! Even a lot of the original "western" dragons are more mammalian-looking with reptile features tacked on, I was just guessing based on seeing how some people react to non-reptilian features (which I think is silly but its a surprisingly common sentiment with dragon games like this)

@corvidus @Sorel I don't think anyone is arguing against having more diverse body types. From the points I have seen from both sides, one side is trying to understand / rationalize why the FR team has decided to opt for a safer middle way as opposed to veering one way or the other.

I work in a software development environment myself, and when we produce a product we always have to weight the costs / benefits for each decision, and time / resources is one of them. I am only trying to rationalize the way the FR team has utilized the time and resources given to them. I like the idea of dragons with cool / unique anatomy - I have been moreso concerned with the decisions / development pipeline that results in the end product.