gently places down one more badge to the growing pile of community-made flair issue badges and leaves
Flight Rising Discussion
Discuss everything and anything Flight Rising.
TOPIC | welp there goes my love of flair
[i]gently places down one more badge to the growing pile of community-made flair issue badges and leaves[/i]
[img]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/783805656107843623/925549398891569232/DGe6jR18wAAAABJRU5ErkJggg.png[/img]
this is exactly why i havent done a single obe project since they've released. they're just too fundamentally broken. every time i scry something up i wonder if what i'm seeing is due to some error and it'll be corrected in a few months, or even a year later, and my dragon will be radically different from how it looked when i designed it.
if these changes were faster and more consistent close to the breeds' release, it'd be understandable that growing pains like this would happen, but these are just utterly ridiculous time scales to where it's INEVITABLLY going to negatively affect players' projects in very unfair ways. i would rather new breeds be delayed heavily as long as they're being actively tested so their release has as few issues as possible, rather than have correcting them be a multi-month or even multi-year fiasco due to lack of transparency.
the solution to this is obviously just restoring the flair colors. not changing every existing obe or every existing maned dragon. the goal is to NOT mess with existing project dragons, or to mess with them as little as possible. it isn't to "standardize" things. lack of standardization isn't why people are upset. it needs to be understood that 6 months+ is WAY past the acceptable window for major gene color changes in these dragons, even if they were initially errors.
if these changes were faster and more consistent close to the breeds' release, it'd be understandable that growing pains like this would happen, but these are just utterly ridiculous time scales to where it's INEVITABLLY going to negatively affect players' projects in very unfair ways. i would rather new breeds be delayed heavily as long as they're being actively tested so their release has as few issues as possible, rather than have correcting them be a multi-month or even multi-year fiasco due to lack of transparency.
the solution to this is obviously just restoring the flair colors. not changing every existing obe or every existing maned dragon. the goal is to NOT mess with existing project dragons, or to mess with them as little as possible. it isn't to "standardize" things. lack of standardization isn't why people are upset. it needs to be understood that 6 months+ is WAY past the acceptable window for major gene color changes in these dragons, even if they were initially errors.
this is exactly why i havent done a single obe project since they've released. they're just too fundamentally broken. every time i scry something up i wonder if what i'm seeing is due to some error and it'll be corrected in a few months, or even a year later, and my dragon will be radically different from how it looked when i designed it.
if these changes were faster and more consistent close to the breeds' release, it'd be understandable that growing pains like this would happen, but these are just utterly ridiculous time scales to where it's INEVITABLLY going to negatively affect players' projects in very unfair ways. i would rather new breeds be delayed heavily as long as they're being actively tested so their release has as few issues as possible, rather than have correcting them be a multi-month or even multi-year fiasco due to lack of transparency.
the solution to this is obviously just restoring the flair colors. not changing every existing obe or every existing maned dragon. the goal is to NOT mess with existing project dragons, or to mess with them as little as possible. it isn't to "standardize" things. lack of standardization isn't why people are upset. it needs to be understood that 6 months+ is WAY past the acceptable window for major gene color changes in these dragons, even if they were initially errors.
if these changes were faster and more consistent close to the breeds' release, it'd be understandable that growing pains like this would happen, but these are just utterly ridiculous time scales to where it's INEVITABLLY going to negatively affect players' projects in very unfair ways. i would rather new breeds be delayed heavily as long as they're being actively tested so their release has as few issues as possible, rather than have correcting them be a multi-month or even multi-year fiasco due to lack of transparency.
the solution to this is obviously just restoring the flair colors. not changing every existing obe or every existing maned dragon. the goal is to NOT mess with existing project dragons, or to mess with them as little as possible. it isn't to "standardize" things. lack of standardization isn't why people are upset. it needs to be understood that 6 months+ is WAY past the acceptable window for major gene color changes in these dragons, even if they were initially errors.
Whew, the sheer melodrama of this thread is a LOT. Acting like dragons and an entire gene have been "ruined" is simply uncalled for.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
----
EDIT TO ADD:
@Witchdistance @IAmV
Of the various "default" eye colors, only Light received a noteworthy change from its original state. (I was very active in the threads comparing and contrasting at the time.) There were also some tweaks to Plague eyes iirc, but only to make them the same shade of red across all breeds.
In general, the eye change impacted 90% of dragons approximately not at all; a number of people simply became upset that there was a new layer of customization that made previously complete dragons feel suddenly not-so-complete.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
----
EDIT TO ADD:
@Witchdistance @IAmV
Of the various "default" eye colors, only Light received a noteworthy change from its original state. (I was very active in the threads comparing and contrasting at the time.) There were also some tweaks to Plague eyes iirc, but only to make them the same shade of red across all breeds.
In general, the eye change impacted 90% of dragons approximately not at all; a number of people simply became upset that there was a new layer of customization that made previously complete dragons feel suddenly not-so-complete.
Whew, the sheer melodrama of this thread is a LOT. Acting like dragons and an entire gene have been "ruined" is simply uncalled for.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
----
EDIT TO ADD:
@Witchdistance @IAmV
Of the various "default" eye colors, only Light received a noteworthy change from its original state. (I was very active in the threads comparing and contrasting at the time.) There were also some tweaks to Plague eyes iirc, but only to make them the same shade of red across all breeds.
In general, the eye change impacted 90% of dragons approximately not at all; a number of people simply became upset that there was a new layer of customization that made previously complete dragons feel suddenly not-so-complete.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
----
EDIT TO ADD:
@Witchdistance @IAmV
Of the various "default" eye colors, only Light received a noteworthy change from its original state. (I was very active in the threads comparing and contrasting at the time.) There were also some tweaks to Plague eyes iirc, but only to make them the same shade of red across all breeds.
In general, the eye change impacted 90% of dragons approximately not at all; a number of people simply became upset that there was a new layer of customization that made previously complete dragons feel suddenly not-so-complete.
|
she/her | FR +2 previously Tuberose |
[quote name="Thalath" date="2021-12-28 16:39:18" ]
[quote name="Server" date="2021-12-28 16:38:36" ]
[quote name="hoghops" date="2021-12-28 16:34:25" ]
still prefer the original but lord this community blows up easy
you'll live without your dragon being the right shade of brown lmao
[/quote]
That is true, but some people paid for gems to gene their dragons with. Some users paid real life money for "those right shades of brown".
I feel like if this isn't talked about, staff might sweep it under the rug for a year like the eyepocalypse.
[/quote]
Not to mention it's a much larger change than "lol its the wrong shade of brown get over it XD". It changes a lot of dragons pretty drastically.
This also sets a very bad precedent.
tl;dr nice bait post
[/quote]
Yeah, like, it's a drastic change compared to a different shade. ie banana went from blue and pink to green and yellow. It's not just a different shade.
Thalath wrote on 2021-12-28 16:39:18:
Server wrote on 2021-12-28 16:38:36:
hoghops wrote on 2021-12-28 16:34:25:
still prefer the original but lord this community blows up easy
you'll live without your dragon being the right shade of brown lmao
you'll live without your dragon being the right shade of brown lmao
I feel like if this isn't talked about, staff might sweep it under the rug for a year like the eyepocalypse.
Not to mention it's a much larger change than "lol its the wrong shade of brown get over it XD". It changes a lot of dragons pretty drastically.
This also sets a very bad precedent.
tl;dr nice bait post
Yeah, like, it's a drastic change compared to a different shade. ie banana went from blue and pink to green and yellow. It's not just a different shade.
|
|
@Tuberose "Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair."
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
@Tuberose "Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair."
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
|
- cillian || adult || he/they Candy Coated Dragons adopts: obelisk | aether
|
[quote name="sackname" date="2021-12-28 12:32:55" ]
My project before:
[img]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/873766170614968320/923780638794977320/dragon.png[/img]
What it looks like now:
[img]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/873766170614968320/925438357486575706/dragon.png[/img]
put it back [i]please[/i]
[/quote]
Oh my goodness your Obi went from stunning to flat - Agree - put it back Please.
sackname wrote on 2021-12-28 12:32:55:
My project before:
What it looks like now:
put it back please
What it looks like now:
put it back please
Oh my goodness your Obi went from stunning to flat - Agree - put it back Please.
[quote name="Thalath" date="2021-12-28 16:39:18" ]This also sets a very bad precedent.[/quote]
Thalath wrote on 2021-12-28 16:39:18:
This also sets a very bad precedent.
Why can't they just revert Flair Obelisk to the old version? I honestly like the old version better, but because I don't have any Flair Obelisks currently, I'm voting for the first option so Silica can stay as he is. I really wish the staff could see some sense and just change Obes back to how they were before this update though.
Why can't they just revert Flair Obelisk to the old version? I honestly like the old version better, but because I don't have any Flair Obelisks currently, I'm voting for the first option so Silica can stay as he is. I really wish the staff could see some sense and just change Obes back to how they were before this update though.
|
SilverRipple Female ~ She/They FR+15 hrs Avatar |
[quote name="Tuberose" date="2021-12-28 16:47:57" ]
Whew, the sheer melodrama of this thread is a LOT. Acting like dragons and an entire gene have been "ruined" is simply uncalled for.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
[/quote]
Unfortunately, I cannot consider this 'melodramatic' on the part of users who are, for the most part, being entirely civil in this thread. Also, people spend real-world money on these dragons and those plans for many of them are now worthless, and they have no way of getting a refund at this current time for the money they spent. That is not a good business look, all around. Losing player trust will result in a drop of sales, which is a big deal when you are a smaller company. While you sit there and say people are 'melodramatic' other people are choosing where they will better be spending their money and investing their time.
Obelisks manes cover a good 40% or more of the dragon's body, so the change in color from brown to orange or gradient to dull and flat is a huge difference, especially one that is uncalled for and occurred overnight and without warning. Obelisks were used to heavily advertise Flair, and the amount of people who have put flair on their obelisks (over 16k dragons, not including breeding plans), reflects this successful marketing. The uniqueness of the gene on obelisks gained the site a large amount of profit as people spent money to gene up dragons and dress them and pay for skins. That's no laughing matter, that's the money people spend that they could be spending on anything else, that they also don't know if they can get back. It's not 'melodramatic'. It's insanely sensitive and important to understand this.
I have no flair dragons that will be affected by this, nor obelisks that will be affected. But I think downplaying the severity of the issue that 50+ pages of people's concerns is not the best move. There are good points that have come up, and also, the poll is absolutely horrendous and out of touch and reminds me more of hidden clauses tucked away in laws, more than actually listening to the playerbase. This is not okay, because either way, 15k+ dragons will be affected adversely and changed overnight. This isn't okay, and honestly, some of my trust in the site has been diminished and im not even affected.
But yeah, if people here are giving respect to the dev team while voicing their VERY VALID concerns, it is NOT okay to sit there and disrespect those who are voicing their concerns for the dev team to see and comment on. This may be a dragon game, but yeesh, have a little bit more dignity than that, mate.
Tuberose wrote on 2021-12-28 16:47:57:
Whew, the sheer melodrama of this thread is a LOT. Acting like dragons and an entire gene have been "ruined" is simply uncalled for.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
Furthermore, people acting like this is some sign that the staff simply don't care?? That's just wild to me, when the reality is that people fuss about gene inconsistency over in Bug Reports all the time, and we have here a very open and transparent case of communication with users paired with comparatively very swift action on the staff's part.
The comparison to "eyepocalypse" is also out of place. We had three years of the new eye system before staff completely upended an entire mini economy and collecting community with not a word of warning, never mind a poll about whether we liked the change after the fact!
My personal lingering badfeels aside, the current approach with flair shows that the staff in fact ARE learning from past missteps and doing their best to respond both swiftly and in a way that's mindful of the community. Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair.
Unfortunately, I cannot consider this 'melodramatic' on the part of users who are, for the most part, being entirely civil in this thread. Also, people spend real-world money on these dragons and those plans for many of them are now worthless, and they have no way of getting a refund at this current time for the money they spent. That is not a good business look, all around. Losing player trust will result in a drop of sales, which is a big deal when you are a smaller company. While you sit there and say people are 'melodramatic' other people are choosing where they will better be spending their money and investing their time.
Obelisks manes cover a good 40% or more of the dragon's body, so the change in color from brown to orange or gradient to dull and flat is a huge difference, especially one that is uncalled for and occurred overnight and without warning. Obelisks were used to heavily advertise Flair, and the amount of people who have put flair on their obelisks (over 16k dragons, not including breeding plans), reflects this successful marketing. The uniqueness of the gene on obelisks gained the site a large amount of profit as people spent money to gene up dragons and dress them and pay for skins. That's no laughing matter, that's the money people spend that they could be spending on anything else, that they also don't know if they can get back. It's not 'melodramatic'. It's insanely sensitive and important to understand this.
I have no flair dragons that will be affected by this, nor obelisks that will be affected. But I think downplaying the severity of the issue that 50+ pages of people's concerns is not the best move. There are good points that have come up, and also, the poll is absolutely horrendous and out of touch and reminds me more of hidden clauses tucked away in laws, more than actually listening to the playerbase. This is not okay, because either way, 15k+ dragons will be affected adversely and changed overnight. This isn't okay, and honestly, some of my trust in the site has been diminished and im not even affected.
But yeah, if people here are giving respect to the dev team while voicing their VERY VALID concerns, it is NOT okay to sit there and disrespect those who are voicing their concerns for the dev team to see and comment on. This may be a dragon game, but yeesh, have a little bit more dignity than that, mate.
[quote name="hungryhobbits" date="2021-12-28 16:51:37" ]
/Tuberose "Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair."
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
[/quote]
[font=helvetica]@hungryhobbits
I'm not sure I'm understanding what you're getting at here, because the staff said themselves that yes, it was an honest human error? And afaik they at no point have claimed that it wasn't an error.
Mistakes happen even with the best of intentions, and "simply Choose not to make mistakes, ever" isn't a reasonable standard to hold [i]any[/i] company to, much less one with such a small team like FR.
(If that's not what you meant/there [i]was[/i] a point where the FR team explicitly said the gene on obelisks wasn't an error, please let me know! Like I said, I'm not sure I'm getting your meaning.)
hungryhobbits wrote on 2021-12-28 16:51:37:
/Tuberose "Asking them to also abandon their own art guidelines for the site—which are an important element of quality control—just isn't fair."
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
if it was so important then they wouldn't have advertised it as not being broken and released it when it was actually correct beforehand, just saying
@hungryhobbits
I'm not sure I'm understanding what you're getting at here, because the staff said themselves that yes, it was an honest human error? And afaik they at no point have claimed that it wasn't an error.
Mistakes happen even with the best of intentions, and "simply Choose not to make mistakes, ever" isn't a reasonable standard to hold any company to, much less one with such a small team like FR.
(If that's not what you meant/there was a point where the FR team explicitly said the gene on obelisks wasn't an error, please let me know! Like I said, I'm not sure I'm getting your meaning.)
|
|
she/her | FR +2 previously Tuberose |