I agree with what a lot of you are saying. The problem is psychological and putting stricter gun laws may make the situation slightly better; but, it just isn't going to solve the problem.
Now, the problem with psychological problems is that they are so hard to tackle. Unlike physical laws that you can put down and enforce, this is something so subtle that people don't even usually notice or know it exists. More the trouble if this mindset has been deeply ingrained for so many years - of course people are not going to change in a day, month, or year.
I think this obsession with guns comes from a country that prides itself in its independence and strength. America had to fight tooth and claw to get to where it is now. No wonder they are so adamant to give up the tools they depended on so much.
We need to get rid of the negative stigma regarding mental illness. We need to get rid of society's perception of men as people who need to be strong and powerful in order to be respected, and that reaching out for help truly doesn't make you weak.
I agree with what a lot of you are saying. The problem is psychological and putting stricter gun laws may make the situation slightly better; but, it just isn't going to solve the problem.
Now, the problem with psychological problems is that they are so hard to tackle. Unlike physical laws that you can put down and enforce, this is something so subtle that people don't even usually notice or know it exists. More the trouble if this mindset has been deeply ingrained for so many years - of course people are not going to change in a day, month, or year.
I think this obsession with guns comes from a country that prides itself in its independence and strength. America had to fight tooth and claw to get to where it is now. No wonder they are so adamant to give up the tools they depended on so much.
We need to get rid of the negative stigma regarding mental illness. We need to get rid of society's perception of men as people who need to be strong and powerful in order to be respected, and that reaching out for help truly doesn't make you weak.
@
Jebii
I wouldn't consider what happened in the past as being Americans fighting tooth and nail to gain what they wanted considering we stole and are still stealing land from those who were here before us and caused them terrible, horrible strife that nothing will make up for. No, for some of them they don't want to lose their tools of oppression
@
Jebii
I wouldn't consider what happened in the past as being Americans fighting tooth and nail to gain what they wanted considering we stole and are still stealing land from those who were here before us and caused them terrible, horrible strife that nothing will make up for. No, for some of them they don't want to lose their tools of oppression
Well-behaved women seldom make history - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
End corruption now
@
Plenilune
I can definitely see what you mean. I was also thinking along the lines of internal fighting as well, for independence from Britain as well civil wars and stuff. But then again I am no expert in American history.
@
Plenilune
I can definitely see what you mean. I was also thinking along the lines of internal fighting as well, for independence from Britain as well civil wars and stuff. But then again I am no expert in American history.
@
Jebii
The problem with a lot of American's patriotism comes from people considering the country to be a shining paragon that has never done anything wrong when that is quite untrue. Our history is filled with vast accounts of horrors we carried out in the past and have continued to do even now. The US is not a good country
@
Jebii
The problem with a lot of American's patriotism comes from people considering the country to be a shining paragon that has never done anything wrong when that is quite untrue. Our history is filled with vast accounts of horrors we carried out in the past and have continued to do even now. The US is not a good country
Well-behaved women seldom make history - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
End corruption now
I understand those, who have passions for guns and who know how to accurately use them (I have the same passion for swords, bows and crossbows). But there have to be at least more restrictions... Just to to make sure, children don't have access to guns.
Even, when it seems somehow useless now, it may show results in one or two decades, maybe. And if the society can help people with mental illnesses even more, there probably won't be so many problems in the future.
I understand those, who have passions for guns and who know how to accurately use them (I have the same passion for swords, bows and crossbows). But there have to be at least more restrictions... Just to to make sure, children don't have access to guns.
Even, when it seems somehow useless now, it may show results in one or two decades, maybe. And if the society can help people with mental illnesses even more, there probably won't be so many problems in the future.
Free in mind and true in heart... A long journey awaits me.
Honestly I'm fed up with the whole system.
The only way for change to happen, whether or not you want stricter laws or not, is it has to happen within the government. But guess what? The American government failing ( at least in my eyes ). Politicians are too busy bickering with one another to get anything done and as each day goes by they are growing more and more divided.
This really irritates me because politicians can't put on their big girl/boy panties and try and find a compromise. Then with the 2016 election coming up, for all we know the government could become split again ( Republicans in charge of the Executive branch and the Democrats in charge of the Legislative branch or vice versa ).
Another thing that I'm extremely disappointed about is the mental health care in America. It is absolutely ridiculous how bad it's getting. For example, in Iowa ( if I recall correctly ) one of the few centers for the mentally ill closed so now there's only one ( I believe ) main center left in the state where the mentally ill can go. That is truly disgusting and very disturbing for me.
So unless something changes like our politicians actually try and get along for once ( I highly doubt it though. Just look at Sandy Hook, did that change much? Not really. ) , more lives will be lost and trust me I believe it's only going to get worse.
Honestly I'm fed up with the whole system.
The only way for change to happen, whether or not you want stricter laws or not, is it has to happen within the government. But guess what? The American government failing ( at least in my eyes ). Politicians are too busy bickering with one another to get anything done and as each day goes by they are growing more and more divided.
This really irritates me because politicians can't put on their big girl/boy panties and try and find a compromise. Then with the 2016 election coming up, for all we know the government could become split again ( Republicans in charge of the Executive branch and the Democrats in charge of the Legislative branch or vice versa ).
Another thing that I'm extremely disappointed about is the mental health care in America. It is absolutely ridiculous how bad it's getting. For example, in Iowa ( if I recall correctly ) one of the few centers for the mentally ill closed so now there's only one ( I believe ) main center left in the state where the mentally ill can go. That is truly disgusting and very disturbing for me.
So unless something changes like our politicians actually try and get along for once ( I highly doubt it though. Just look at Sandy Hook, did that change much? Not really. ) , more lives will be lost and trust me I believe it's only going to get worse.
I have really enjoyed reading everyone's opinion and input in this thread. It's nice to see so many people sitting down and talking about the issue.
What worries me is the "bury your head in the sand" mannerisms of some people.
How many excuses will be made and what atrocity needs to happen before America accepts that something needs to change? There is something very drastically wrong with the system but there are always a million explanations and excuses rather than change. Yes the right to bear arms may be American but innocent people are dying at the end of those arms. Is the right to bear arms more important than keeping children safe? I couldn't possibly comment as I don't have the Patriotic background, but the idea that owning a handgun in a residential area is of higher importance than lowering mass shootings country-wide truly baffles me.
I have really enjoyed reading everyone's opinion and input in this thread. It's nice to see so many people sitting down and talking about the issue.
What worries me is the "bury your head in the sand" mannerisms of some people.
How many excuses will be made and what atrocity needs to happen before America accepts that something needs to change? There is something very drastically wrong with the system but there are always a million explanations and excuses rather than change. Yes the right to bear arms may be American but innocent people are dying at the end of those arms. Is the right to bear arms more important than keeping children safe? I couldn't possibly comment as I don't have the Patriotic background, but the idea that owning a handgun in a residential area is of higher importance than lowering mass shootings country-wide truly baffles me.
Whenever this topic comes up, it just angers me. Many Australians, including me, just don't understand how the US isn't taking more preventative measures with regard to gun control. The amount of people murdered in the US with the aid of a gun is insane.
I realise I'm biased; I've grown up in a society where guns are not easily obtained, firearm licences are strictly enforced and guns are required to be locked up and separated from ammo when not in use. But these restrictions have made Australia safer. If Americans grew up the same way, and were on the outside looking in, I think many of you would be just as appalled.
Whenever this topic comes up, it just angers me. Many Australians, including me, just don't understand how the US isn't taking more preventative measures with regard to gun control. The amount of people murdered in the US with the aid of a gun is insane.
I realise I'm biased; I've grown up in a society where guns are not easily obtained, firearm licences are strictly enforced and guns are required to be locked up and separated from ammo when not in use. But these restrictions have made Australia safer. If Americans grew up the same way, and were on the outside looking in, I think many of you would be just as appalled.
I was going to quote this article, but the whole thing is good and should be read in its entirety:
http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2015/10/gun-control-is-the-only-way-out.html
In it are facts like, America may have similar rates of violence* when compared to similarly developed countries, but it has a higher rate of
murder.
*When looking at violence statistics, you have to keep in mind that nations can, and do, define violent crime differently. The USA, for instance, only includes aggravated assault in it's definition of violent crime, but Britain includes all forms of assault. Direct comparison of these two statistics, therefore, is useless without being able to manipulate the data to compare the same thing.
I was going to quote this article, but the whole thing is good and should be read in its entirety:
http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2015/10/gun-control-is-the-only-way-out.html
In it are facts like, America may have similar rates of violence* when compared to similarly developed countries, but it has a higher rate of
murder.
*When looking at violence statistics, you have to keep in mind that nations can, and do, define violent crime differently. The USA, for instance, only includes aggravated assault in it's definition of violent crime, but Britain includes all forms of assault. Direct comparison of these two statistics, therefore, is useless without being able to manipulate the data to compare the same thing.
[quote name="Shez" date=2015-10-02 22:25:01]
Whenever this topic comes up, it just angers me. Many Australians, including me, just don't understand how the US isn't taking more preventative measures with regard to gun control. The amount of people murdered in the US with the aid of a gun is insane.[/quote]
Pretty much what @Shez said. I mean, my mother and I were talking about this issue today and we were talking about how disgusted we were with a country that wants to hold onto something so desperately that they're willing to see so many of these awful events happen on an increasingly regular basis, while there are literally examples of entire continents (i.e. us) who embraced stricter gun laws and oh, look, our mass murders relating to guns basically disappeared and stayed that way for easily over a decade.
I'm not saying Australia is perfect, it's really not (looks at the ex-Onion Eating Lizard King as proof of that), but I feel like there are political powers (and citizens that support them) in the USA who are so anti-progress they'll put people's lives on the line to make a point about a Constitution which let's face it - will (like anything) become outdated in parts. Even the Bible became outdated and that's the Word of God, a Constitution certainly can. What worked for settlers and colonists back in the day (and let's face it - that was built on a whole lot of massacres and oppression) may not work for a future society that is trying to - I don't know - move away from those things.
I have some great friends from the USA, but I will never visit the country to see them. I'd rather pay for them to come out here (if only I could afford it). Between the draconian healthcare policies (which have only somewhat been assisted by Obamacare), rabid enthusiasm for guns that literally leads to children and students dying, and an oligarchic economy and government, I really feel for the people who want a different future and want better things, and yet get trodden down by those in more power again and again - or worse, killed while trying to further their educations.
(Though you folks did get the gay marriage thing right, that was awesome).
Shez wrote on 2015-10-02:
Whenever this topic comes up, it just angers me. Many Australians, including me, just don't understand how the US isn't taking more preventative measures with regard to gun control. The amount of people murdered in the US with the aid of a gun is insane.
Pretty much what @
Shez said. I mean, my mother and I were talking about this issue today and we were talking about how disgusted we were with a country that wants to hold onto something so desperately that they're willing to see so many of these awful events happen on an increasingly regular basis, while there are literally examples of entire continents (i.e. us) who embraced stricter gun laws and oh, look, our mass murders relating to guns basically disappeared and stayed that way for easily over a decade.
I'm not saying Australia is perfect, it's really not (looks at the ex-Onion Eating Lizard King as proof of that), but I feel like there are political powers (and citizens that support them) in the USA who are so anti-progress they'll put people's lives on the line to make a point about a Constitution which let's face it - will (like anything) become outdated in parts. Even the Bible became outdated and that's the Word of God, a Constitution certainly can. What worked for settlers and colonists back in the day (and let's face it - that was built on a whole lot of massacres and oppression) may not work for a future society that is trying to - I don't know - move away from those things.
I have some great friends from the USA, but I will never visit the country to see them. I'd rather pay for them to come out here (if only I could afford it). Between the draconian healthcare policies (which have only somewhat been assisted by Obamacare), rabid enthusiasm for guns that literally leads to children and students dying, and an oligarchic economy and government, I really feel for the people who want a different future and want better things, and yet get trodden down by those in more power again and again - or worse, killed while trying to further their educations.
(Though you folks did get the gay marriage thing right, that was awesome).
