I don't think it's unfair for Plague to want something more suited to our theme, and I don't think it's offensive to express as much.
Personally, I'd love to see something more suited to our lore as a Plague venue. The Mire is a great place for grinding and farming, but it in no way strikes me as Plague. It's a fairly standard swamp.
I suppose my longing for a truly Plague venue is largely cancelled out by the fact that the Mire is really the best place for many to go for... well, a lot. Doesn't stop the wishing, though. :)
I don't think it's unfair for Plague to want something more suited to our theme, and I don't think it's offensive to express as much.
Personally, I'd love to see something more suited to our lore as a Plague venue. The Mire is a great place for grinding and farming, but it in no way strikes me as Plague. It's a fairly standard swamp.
I suppose my longing for a truly Plague venue is largely cancelled out by the fact that the Mire is really the best place for many to go for... well, a lot. Doesn't stop the wishing, though. :)
[quote name="Pyrali" date=2016-10-24 13:40:23]
I mean fucking Neopets has images of pets that are wounded, injured, and beaten up. Or y'know, literal carcasses of neglected pets. And I mean. That's bloody [i]Neopets.[/i]
[/quote]
Haha, a petsite I frequent has a design for pets that turns them into this:
[url=http://www.misticpets.com/images/pets/apocalyptic/apocalyptic_kratork.jpg]Link one[/url]
[url=http://www.misticpets.com/images/pets/apocalyptic/apocalyptic_skillow.jpg]Link two[/url]
And terms of services that say this:
[quote]PG-13 - Parents Strongly Cautioned Some material may be inappropriate for children under 13.
Horror/Gore- All graphics and written works may not expose internal organs, or spell out explicit murder/killing scenes, but there may be content that is bloody or horrific in some manner.[/quote]
I wish FR had a similar outlook on such content. It makes me happy because it says to me that the site trusts its users to know where their limits are, and to avoid them proactively and in respect to others. It entrusts responsibility to the users, and it feels empowering when people can respect your views to not trade for pets like that and such.
Drawing a line and communicating it is so crucial to the whole formula though; when people are unsure or confused about where it is, you get countless amounts of frustration, anger, and even apprehension. And FR definitely needs to improve in the communication department.
Err, didn't mean for this to get so off-topic, haha.
Edit: Wow did I screw up those links.
Pyrali wrote on 2016-10-24:
I mean ******* Neopets has images of pets that are wounded, injured, and beaten up. Or y'know, literal carcasses of neglected pets. And I mean. That's bloody Neopets.
Haha, a petsite I frequent has a design for pets that turns them into this:
Link one
Link two
And terms of services that say this:
Quote:
PG-13 - Parents Strongly Cautioned Some material may be inappropriate for children under 13.
Horror/Gore- All graphics and written works may not expose internal organs, or spell out explicit murder/killing scenes, but there may be content that is bloody or horrific in some manner.
I wish FR had a similar outlook on such content. It makes me happy because it says to me that the site trusts its users to know where their limits are, and to avoid them proactively and in respect to others. It entrusts responsibility to the users, and it feels empowering when people can respect your views to not trade for pets like that and such.
Drawing a line and communicating it is so crucial to the whole formula though; when people are unsure or confused about where it is, you get countless amounts of frustration, anger, and even apprehension. And FR definitely needs to improve in the communication department.
Err, didn't mean for this to get so off-topic, haha.
Edit: Wow did I screw up those links.
But again, this isn't Neopets.
I do agree that some more....explanatory rules would be nice, because "cannot show a dragon suffering" is both a really wide and really specific net. It basically means "what the judges consider to be suffering" and that's really difficult to judge considering we don't really know how skins/accents are chosen as winners. Personally, I'd consider some of the winning skins to be "suffering" so that's just proof it's not really a reliable rule.
I could get behind specific rules like "no exposed organs" or the like, because that's straight to the point of what kind of stuff isn't acceptable. At this point, I don't think anyone is totally sure.
But again, this isn't Neopets.
I do agree that some more....explanatory rules would be nice, because "cannot show a dragon suffering" is both a really wide and really specific net. It basically means "what the judges consider to be suffering" and that's really difficult to judge considering we don't really know how skins/accents are chosen as winners. Personally, I'd consider some of the winning skins to be "suffering" so that's just proof it's not really a reliable rule.
I could get behind specific rules like "no exposed organs" or the like, because that's straight to the point of what kind of stuff isn't acceptable. At this point, I don't think anyone is totally sure.
I'm not going to get invested in this argument because I don't have the time to worry about this, but I just have to say:
[quote]Again, I really just think that they didn't properly expect what Plague would be like when they decided to use it as a concept. They didn't put enough rules down to start with, and now they have to go back and enforce rules because people ran to uncomfortable places with the Plague theme.[/quote]
If the admins truly didn't anticipate a flight modeled after disease to have, y'know, dragons that suffer with some semblance of body horror/gore/disturbing themes to it, then wow. What a lack of foresight. It's pretty much common sense. How many diseases do you know that are pleasant to experience? Plague is about survival and overcoming suffering, which of course means that sometimes suffering [i]has to occur[/i] to become stronger.
They had years of planning prior to the site's launch to rethink the flight concepts. I think Plaguelings have the right to feel affronted at how drastically the rules have changed, especially considering each time there was no communication whatsoever beforehand to prepare us.
(And since tone doesn't translate via the internet: I agree with your argument, McAlli, that they [s]definitely[/s] probably didn't handle this in the best way. Any frustration read in this post is my own at the handling of the flight by the admins over the years.)
That said, I don't mind the venue. The timing is dumb, of course, and I'm a little bummed, but the anger over it stems more from Plaguelings feeling like the admins aren't even batting an eye to all the concerns that have been festering ([i]heh[/i]) for years now.
I'm not going to get invested in this argument because I don't have the time to worry about this, but I just have to say:
Quote:
Again, I really just think that they didn't properly expect what Plague would be like when they decided to use it as a concept. They didn't put enough rules down to start with, and now they have to go back and enforce rules because people ran to uncomfortable places with the Plague theme.
If the admins truly didn't anticipate a flight modeled after disease to have, y'know, dragons that suffer with some semblance of body horror/gore/disturbing themes to it, then wow. What a lack of foresight. It's pretty much common sense. How many diseases do you know that are pleasant to experience? Plague is about survival and overcoming suffering, which of course means that sometimes suffering
has to occur to become stronger.
They had years of planning prior to the site's launch to rethink the flight concepts. I think Plaguelings have the right to feel affronted at how drastically the rules have changed, especially considering each time there was no communication whatsoever beforehand to prepare us.
(And since tone doesn't translate via the internet: I agree with your argument, McAlli, that they
definitely probably didn't handle this in the best way. Any frustration read in this post is my own at the handling of the flight by the admins over the years.)
That said, I don't mind the venue. The timing is dumb, of course, and I'm a little bummed, but the anger over it stems more from Plaguelings feeling like the admins aren't even batting an eye to all the concerns that have been festering (
heh) for years now.
[quote name="Exsanguinate" date=2016-10-24 05:30:15]
y'all throw hissy fits and call people ungrateful and salty over a fairly valid concern but GOD FORBID they change the stupid flags or make your username look slightly bigger in the forums.
ok.
[/quote]
Exsanguinate wrote on 2016-10-24:
y'all throw hissy fits and call people ungrateful and salty over a fairly valid concern but GOD FORBID they change the stupid flags or make your username look slightly bigger in the forums.
ok.
@
Pained (hope you don't mind the ping)
What I mean when I say I don't think they really thought ahead about it, is that they probably brainstormed all the ways it could have been taken but since they were a small team who then opened the theme up to literally thousands of players, they couldn't have possibly foreseen everything that these players would do.
I compare it to a situation I found myself in many years ago, when I was running an RP group. Us leaders had set rules down, but then once user started doing stuff that was against the rules -- but in such a way that we hadn't specifically addressed it, and so that roleplayer was just blatantly abusing that loophole. Of course, they complained about being 'singled out' when we had to close that loophole, but the fact of the matter was that we just hasn't foreseen someone doing that, and so we hadn't made a rule against is, and so someone obviously found that and exploited it.
This is not me saying that all people who have tried to make plague skins are those" Given an Inch, Took a Mile" kind of folks. Just that I don't think the admins considered how far people would push the plague theme. I think all of them kind of went "this is how far I would push it, and I think up to this point it's okay" and thought, as people do, that everyone else had about the same thresholds. But that's just not what happened, and now we're kind of dealing with that need to clean up that mistake.
@
Pained (hope you don't mind the ping)
What I mean when I say I don't think they really thought ahead about it, is that they probably brainstormed all the ways it could have been taken but since they were a small team who then opened the theme up to literally thousands of players, they couldn't have possibly foreseen everything that these players would do.
I compare it to a situation I found myself in many years ago, when I was running an RP group. Us leaders had set rules down, but then once user started doing stuff that was against the rules -- but in such a way that we hadn't specifically addressed it, and so that roleplayer was just blatantly abusing that loophole. Of course, they complained about being 'singled out' when we had to close that loophole, but the fact of the matter was that we just hasn't foreseen someone doing that, and so we hadn't made a rule against is, and so someone obviously found that and exploited it.
This is not me saying that all people who have tried to make plague skins are those" Given an Inch, Took a Mile" kind of folks. Just that I don't think the admins considered how far people would push the plague theme. I think all of them kind of went "this is how far I would push it, and I think up to this point it's okay" and thought, as people do, that everyone else had about the same thresholds. But that's just not what happened, and now we're kind of dealing with that need to clean up that mistake.
I understand why you guys are disappointed that you didn't get a cool new plague venue, but I think you guys are taking it way too far. How? By saying the staff are doing it to spite plague and because they don't care about plague. That's what bothers me.
I just think it's kinda rude to stay that the staff hate your flight just because they released a venue not centered around your flight before RoR and that they did it to spite you guys.
I understand why you guys are disappointed that you didn't get a cool new plague venue, but I think you guys are taking it way too far. How? By saying the staff are doing it to spite plague and because they don't care about plague. That's what bothers me.
I just think it's kinda rude to stay that the staff hate your flight just because they released a venue not centered around your flight before RoR and that they did it to spite you guys.
@
ToonKuriboh
It's a little bit of that, plus the fact that Plague is the most affected by the rather unexplained rules about what skins can and cannot have. While those rules are site wide, Plague is the most affected by the them because of Plague's theme. That frustration is also understandable, but yeah.
@
ToonKuriboh
It's a little bit of that, plus the fact that Plague is the most affected by the rather unexplained rules about what skins can and cannot have. While those rules are site wide, Plague is the most affected by the them because of Plague's theme. That frustration is also understandable, but yeah.
@
McAlli
I agree, but it's still taking it way to far to say that the staff are doing this just because they hate plague.
@
McAlli
I agree, but it's still taking it way to far to say that the staff are doing this just because they hate plague.
@
ToonKuriboh
Yeah. I understand why Plague Flighters feel picked on, but I don't think that's actually the case. I mean, a ton of Shadow Flighters kind of felt that way a few years ago, considering that Light and Wind (though we didn't know it at the time) had two breeds before we got our one. I feel like it's a similar situation.
@
ToonKuriboh
Yeah. I understand why Plague Flighters feel picked on, but I don't think that's actually the case. I mean, a ton of Shadow Flighters kind of felt that way a few years ago, considering that Light and Wind (though we didn't know it at the time) had two breeds before we got our one. I feel like it's a similar situation.
