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Creosote
Maybe it's different for females, but my two girls are spayed and they still hunt A LOT. I can tell from the gopher guts they leave lying around.
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Creosote
Maybe it's different for females, but my two girls are spayed and they still hunt A LOT. I can tell from the gopher guts they leave lying around.
poor thing... needs to update his forum signature and hasn't yet. oh well!
My thing is-people do need to spay and neuter their cats and dogs. Not going to talk about other animals because I don't know. Jiro got neutered at 9 months before I got him. I had that done before I got him. Reason being I didn't want any accidents to happen where he'd get out and find a female in heat, do the doggy do and next thing you know, I'm responsible for pups. Adorable pups, but pups that should have been prevented and may not find homes and end up dead.
Unless you plan on being a legitimate breeder for cats and/or dogs, then yes you do need to get them spayed/neutered. You need to be able to account for everything and anything that can happen-the average person can't which is why we have issues with overpopulation.
The ideal would be to neuter/spay closer to adulthood, but again, the average owner isn't able to make sure the pet will be okay until then-nor do many know about any sort of birth control. How many people make sure their pets stay on flea and ticks prevention as well as heartworm prevention? My area, I find a lot of people mostly do the heartworm but not flea and tick care. It doesn't exactly inspire confidence that they'd keep up on doggy or kitty birth control.
As long as it's not before 6 months, I see no problem and being a responsible pet owner would be to make sure the pet can't reproduce.
Getting spayed/neutered doesn't necessarily mean that their behavior will change completely. Aspects may be reduced-even neutered dogs can still have sex; just they're shooting blanks.
My thing is-people do need to spay and neuter their cats and dogs. Not going to talk about other animals because I don't know. Jiro got neutered at 9 months before I got him. I had that done before I got him. Reason being I didn't want any accidents to happen where he'd get out and find a female in heat, do the doggy do and next thing you know, I'm responsible for pups. Adorable pups, but pups that should have been prevented and may not find homes and end up dead.
Unless you plan on being a legitimate breeder for cats and/or dogs, then yes you do need to get them spayed/neutered. You need to be able to account for everything and anything that can happen-the average person can't which is why we have issues with overpopulation.
The ideal would be to neuter/spay closer to adulthood, but again, the average owner isn't able to make sure the pet will be okay until then-nor do many know about any sort of birth control. How many people make sure their pets stay on flea and ticks prevention as well as heartworm prevention? My area, I find a lot of people mostly do the heartworm but not flea and tick care. It doesn't exactly inspire confidence that they'd keep up on doggy or kitty birth control.
As long as it's not before 6 months, I see no problem and being a responsible pet owner would be to make sure the pet can't reproduce.
Getting spayed/neutered doesn't necessarily mean that their behavior will change completely. Aspects may be reduced-even neutered dogs can still have sex; just they're shooting blanks.
Coelum Ad Proelium Elige
I own the most wonderful Shiba Inus named Jiro and Lou!
What do Shiba Inus~ like to dream about? Is it dancing Hainus?
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Creosote
I'm glad you've had such good luck with your cats! When I adopted my male cat, he was a stray living on the street and so was not fixed. Luckily he was young enough that he hadn't gotten into the habit of spraying yet, but he was just on the cusp of sexual maturity. I promise you he DID stink, BAD. He smelled really strongly of goat, of all things! I thought it was something he'd gotten on him as stray at first, so I tried bathing him. It just made the smell stronger because it was coming out of his fur, and I'd just made his fur warm and damp x_x
The day I got him back from his neuter, the smell had halved, and over the next couple of days it faded entirely. Him stinking and being unfixed were directly related. According to the vet who fixed him, my experience wasn't unusual. These days he smells delightful.
It's great you're using cats as pest control instead of poisons or traps. It's definitely much better for the environment.
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TheHeroicOne
I don't know about the effects being fixed has on a cat's hunting drive. But my mum's overweight 14 year old female cat is still bringing in 1-5 mice a week, and my boy has almost completely wiped out the cockroaches that were infesting this house when I moved in 6 months ago. They're both fixed and well-fed but they still have a pretty high body count. But perhaps a cat's hunting drive is even higher if it's not fixed, I don't know. *shrug*
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Creosote
I'm glad you've had such good luck with your cats! When I adopted my male cat, he was a stray living on the street and so was not fixed. Luckily he was young enough that he hadn't gotten into the habit of spraying yet, but he was just on the cusp of sexual maturity. I promise you he DID stink, BAD. He smelled really strongly of goat, of all things! I thought it was something he'd gotten on him as stray at first, so I tried bathing him. It just made the smell stronger because it was coming out of his fur, and I'd just made his fur warm and damp x_x
The day I got him back from his neuter, the smell had halved, and over the next couple of days it faded entirely. Him stinking and being unfixed were directly related. According to the vet who fixed him, my experience wasn't unusual. These days he smells delightful.
It's great you're using cats as pest control instead of poisons or traps. It's definitely much better for the environment.
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TheHeroicOne
I don't know about the effects being fixed has on a cat's hunting drive. But my mum's overweight 14 year old female cat is still bringing in 1-5 mice a week, and my boy has almost completely wiped out the cockroaches that were infesting this house when I moved in 6 months ago. They're both fixed and well-fed but they still have a pretty high body count. But perhaps a cat's hunting drive is even higher if it's not fixed, I don't know. *shrug*
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ashotinthedark
nope. Not your cats. my boys are pretty high strung and go after everything that moves (no pests yay!) I'm not risking them loosing that just because I should "go get them fixed" They have a purpose, I'm not risking loosing the reason why I own these cats just because someone else lets their female cat roam outside. There's a feral cat colony anyway, and mine still get ran up trees and back on the porch by the big torn up feral tom cats so it's not like they're mounting any of the queens around here anyway.
If my boys prove to be good mousers I AM going to breed them, so far they're great and I haven't seen so much as a mouse whisker in months (used to be so bad they'd fall out of the ceiling onto my brother when he was playing wow) With all the owls and hawks around here I'm not going back to traps or poisons. So both of them are keeping their little fuzzy kitty balls.
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ashotinthedark
nope. Not your cats. my boys are pretty high strung and go after everything that moves (no pests yay!) I'm not risking them loosing that just because I should "go get them fixed" They have a purpose, I'm not risking loosing the reason why I own these cats just because someone else lets their female cat roam outside. There's a feral cat colony anyway, and mine still get ran up trees and back on the porch by the big torn up feral tom cats so it's not like they're mounting any of the queens around here anyway.
If my boys prove to be good mousers I AM going to breed them, so far they're great and I haven't seen so much as a mouse whisker in months (used to be so bad they'd fall out of the ceiling onto my brother when he was playing wow) With all the owls and hawks around here I'm not going back to traps or poisons. So both of them are keeping their little fuzzy kitty balls.
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Creosote
Rather than breed your boys you might want to consider saving another life next time you need another barn cat. There are a many of rescue groups that work to place barn cats. I've known a number of people with working barn cats that have gotten them spayed/neutered and it has never effected their ability to perform. It also has the plus of preventing the cats from getting into unnecessary fights with other strays/ferals which in turn decreases the risk they will get something bad passed along to them.
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Creosote
Rather than breed your boys you might want to consider saving another life next time you need another barn cat. There are a many of rescue groups that work to place barn cats. I've known a number of people with working barn cats that have gotten them spayed/neutered and it has never effected their ability to perform. It also has the plus of preventing the cats from getting into unnecessary fights with other strays/ferals which in turn decreases the risk they will get something bad passed along to them.
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Krissim
and end up with stranger cats that may or may not be accustomed to rabbits and see them as prey animals?
no. If my boys do prove to be good enough mousers to breed I am breeding them and raising the litter around rabbits so they get used to them and don't see them as prey/something they can hunt like I did with my two mousers now. I do not need a feral or a barn cat to ruin a breeding line of lion heads or netherlands rabbits because they either maimed a buck or doe, or stressed one out so much it died from fear.
i'm not stealing homes from cats by breeding my own, no I never wanted those other cats to begin with they were going to stay without a owner/in a shelter or organization regardless.
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Krissim
and end up with stranger cats that may or may not be accustomed to rabbits and see them as prey animals?
no. If my boys do prove to be good enough mousers to breed I am breeding them and raising the litter around rabbits so they get used to them and don't see them as prey/something they can hunt like I did with my two mousers now. I do not need a feral or a barn cat to ruin a breeding line of lion heads or netherlands rabbits because they either maimed a buck or doe, or stressed one out so much it died from fear.
i'm not stealing homes from cats by breeding my own, no I never wanted those other cats to begin with they were going to stay without a owner/in a shelter or organization regardless.
@Creosote
I did a little research, and found a[url=http://www.pet-informed-veterinary-advice-online.com/feline-neutering.html#pros-desex] FAQ about neutering male cats.[/url] If you do ctrl+f and enter 8B, or just look, there is this tidbit:
[quote=Quote From Article]8b. Myth 2 - Desexed male cats lose their drive to hunt vermin.
Although this has yet to be proven, many owners of "mousers" (cats kept to keep rodentand vermin numbers low) will refuse to desex their cats out of the fear that their animals will nolonger have any drive to do the work required of them. They believe that, withoutits testicles (without testosterone), the animal won't catch and kill mice and rats.
As was discussed in section 7c, however, there are many kinds of behaviours, these predatory-type behaviours included, which are not mediated by testosterone levelsat all. These predatory hunting behaviours are instinctive, survival-focussed drives that have been built into the cat species by genetic selection and environmental and preyinfluences over many centuries. Removing the animal's testicles and therefore its testosterone levels should not really have any bearing on the animal's drive to perform these instinctive, non-testosterone-fueled, hunting activities.
One way to consider the matter is to look at the female of the species. Female cats hunt and killrodents as well as male cats do and yet they have no testicles and nowhere near as much testosterone as a male cat. Now, naturally, female cats do have less size, muscling, strengthand stamina than their male counterparts do and, consequently, they may not be as physically adept at certain tasks (e.g. bringing down large-sized vermin) as a male animal.Their drive to fulfill these tasks, however, is just the same, even if their physicalityis not.
Author's note: one could well argue that a tomcat might hunt better if it does not havemale hormonal urges distracting it from the task at hand.
Author's note: neutered tomcats do not grow as bulky, heavy and broad-headed and broad-shouldered as entire tomcats. One could well argue that a lighter, sleeker, neutered tomcat might perform better as a mouser: it will be able to fit into smaller spaces where mice and rats hide;it will jump and land and tread more lightly (making it more capable of creeping up on prey)and, with less weight and bulk to carry, it may even prove to be a faster ambush predator.
Author's note: the only time that a male cat's hunting performance might be adversely affected by desexing surgery is if the cat is allowed to get fat after desexing (point 8a). Fat, neutered cats have less muscle-bulk, strength and stamina than an entire male animal and may, therefore, not be as physically adept at performing certain tasks as an intact male. [/quote]
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Creosote
I did a little research, and found a
FAQ about neutering male cats. If you do ctrl+f and enter 8B, or just look, there is this tidbit:
Quote From Article wrote:
8b. Myth 2 - Desexed male cats lose their drive to hunt vermin.
Although this has yet to be proven, many owners of "mousers" (cats kept to keep rodentand vermin numbers low) will refuse to desex their cats out of the fear that their animals will nolonger have any drive to do the work required of them. They believe that, withoutits testicles (without testosterone), the animal won't catch and kill mice and rats.
As was discussed in section 7c, however, there are many kinds of behaviours, these predatory-type behaviours included, which are not mediated by testosterone levelsat all. These predatory hunting behaviours are instinctive, survival-focussed drives that have been built into the cat species by genetic selection and environmental and preyinfluences over many centuries. Removing the animal's testicles and therefore its testosterone levels should not really have any bearing on the animal's drive to perform these instinctive, non-testosterone-fueled, hunting activities.
One way to consider the matter is to look at the female of the species. Female cats hunt and killrodents as well as male cats do and yet they have no testicles and nowhere near as much testosterone as a male cat. Now, naturally, female cats do have less size, muscling, strengthand stamina than their male counterparts do and, consequently, they may not be as physically adept at certain tasks (e.g. bringing down large-sized vermin) as a male animal.Their drive to fulfill these tasks, however, is just the same, even if their physicalityis not.
Author's note: one could well argue that a tomcat might hunt better if it does not havemale hormonal urges distracting it from the task at hand.
Author's note: neutered tomcats do not grow as bulky, heavy and broad-headed and broad-shouldered as entire tomcats. One could well argue that a lighter, sleeker, neutered tomcat might perform better as a mouser: it will be able to fit into smaller spaces where mice and rats hide;it will jump and land and tread more lightly (making it more capable of creeping up on prey)and, with less weight and bulk to carry, it may even prove to be a faster ambush predator.
Author's note: the only time that a male cat's hunting performance might be adversely affected by desexing surgery is if the cat is allowed to get fat after desexing (point 8a). Fat, neutered cats have less muscle-bulk, strength and stamina than an entire male animal and may, therefore, not be as physically adept at performing certain tasks as an intact male.
poor thing... needs to update his forum signature and hasn't yet. oh well!
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TheHeroicOne
look, until you want to work my shifts at a call center to have enough extra money to pay for the vet care (bought time for more dewormer) then I really don't care what someone over the internet has to say about rather or not I get my males fixed.
I'm not. End of story. I care more about having this alternative to exterminators and traps and poisons when it comes to the birds of prey around here then I do if people agree with me or not.
because at the end of the day I know my actions aren't going to leave a barred/great horn/barn owl dead.
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TheHeroicOne
look, until you want to work my shifts at a call center to have enough extra money to pay for the vet care (bought time for more dewormer) then I really don't care what someone over the internet has to say about rather or not I get my males fixed.
I'm not. End of story. I care more about having this alternative to exterminators and traps and poisons when it comes to the birds of prey around here then I do if people agree with me or not.
because at the end of the day I know my actions aren't going to leave a barred/great horn/barn owl dead.
Yes, unless the animals are owned by licensed, reputable breeders. There should be a minimum age requirement, though. Spaying is pretty serious surgery, and yet I've seen kittens so young they still have blue eyes that have just been spayed. Yes, spay them, but at least wait until they're older!
Yes, unless the animals are owned by licensed, reputable breeders. There should be a minimum age requirement, though. Spaying is pretty serious surgery, and yet I've seen kittens so young they still have blue eyes that have just been spayed. Yes, spay them, but at least wait until they're older!
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luckgandor
Dogs and cats should absolutely be spayed/neutered, but it shouldn't be strictly mandatory or costly. However, the procedures should only be done after at least a year old for dogs (idk what age for cats), because they need the hormones from their reproductive organs in order for their brains to mature properly. Dogs that get spayed/neutered too early tend to be hyperactive puppies for the rest of their lives, and pretty difficult to train.
My local shelters require that all dogs & cats be spayed/neutered before being adopted (not if you already own the animal), but they also offer the procedures free with adoption.
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Hawktalon
Dang, I didn't even think about how
small they'd be if they're spayed young! That's another good point.
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luckgandor
Dogs and cats should absolutely be spayed/neutered, but it shouldn't be strictly mandatory or costly. However, the procedures should only be done after at least a year old for dogs (idk what age for cats), because they need the hormones from their reproductive organs in order for their brains to mature properly. Dogs that get spayed/neutered too early tend to be hyperactive puppies for the rest of their lives, and pretty difficult to train.
My local shelters require that all dogs & cats be spayed/neutered before being adopted (not if you already own the animal), but they also offer the procedures free with adoption.
edit: @
Hawktalon
Dang, I didn't even think about how
small they'd be if they're spayed young! That's another good point.
