Flight Rising Discussion

[quote]Dusthides pass down their history and traditions entirely through oration. While this makes for differing accounts and frequent inconsistencies, it also fosters much celebration and respect for storytellers. A skilled Dusthide historian can keep the most fidgety hatchlings (and adults!) riveted through tales of joy, heartbreak, adventure, or tragedy alike.[/quote] So, this is from the encyclopedia! And I'm noticing a pretty common misconception here, which is the idea that traditions of oral history are necessarily "lesser" than traditions of written history, and their inaccuracy is one of those reasons that cultures which rely on them are also "lesser" than cultures which rely on written histories. Now, a lot of people know that that isn't true, and I'm certain that that is also not what flight rising meant. But for people who don't have a historian and an archeologist on speed dial to ask them what the difference is, "oral history" sounds like it encompasses everything from ghost stories to ten thousand year old recitations of volcanic eruptions. So I understand why staff used it, and I understand that staff didn't mean it in an unkind way. Oral history, like the ones we see in Native American and Native Australian traditions, are very accurate and carefully recited, remembered, and passed on to the next generations. The purpose of the tradition is accuracy and education. That is not what Dusthides are displaying, but if you don't know the right word, I understand why staff used this term instead. Dusthides are engaging in oral mythohistory! This is bardic traditions, arthuriana to a degree (most of that's written these days), so on and so forth. The purpose of the Dusthide oral tradition is socialization. Whether that be education, entertainment, etc., it's not meant as a historical ritual. It's a social ritual. And that uses a different term! Anyways that has been your horrifically long essay as condensed by me, not an expert, from an archaeologist, who is an expert. If you have any questions I will probably have to bother him to answer them!

Oh that's so cool I had never heard this distinction before!

[quote name="Catacombes" date="2024-04-17 13:26:36" ] Oh that's so cool I had never heard this distinction before! [/quote] I hadn't either, until I asked about it! I figured some distinction had to exist, because trying to compare ghost stories and hard-core oral history traditions seems... well, liable to result in misconceptions like the one staff ran into. But the fact that there's a nice, simple term to encompass the difference is great!

not an expert on this sort of thing at all but isn't "inconsistencies" with folklore kind of just a natural occurrence that happens when it reaches people from different cultures and even regions? i mean, you can use dragons as an example even of how much they differ between european or asian countries despite being based on the same concepts (i mean that european dragons have a similar origin but became different in the different countries and the same with asian dragons, lizards vs snakes). but i understand completely what you mean, its just strange that's looked at as a negative when its just something that happens and the changes are what i assume purposeful.

@bulrush With regional folklore yes there are variations to suit different peoples and time periods as these stories reflect how culture changes over time/space and the "moral values" of the people telling it. Think how Robin Hood or fairy tales have changed over time. So it's purposefully malleable to reflect what message/lesson you want to tell your audience.

While oral histories purposefully recollect events or people significant to the culture/people with as much accuracy as you can to preserve the event for future generations. The easiest example I can give is the Inuit oral history of the Erebus and Terror where the location of the ships and survivors (and what happened to them) were know and told about in stories with great accuracy but only until recent marine archaeological and field archaeological digs did western science corroborate with "hard evidence" to prove to western science that the oral history was accurate.

Sorry for the wall of text it's just one of those fascinating topics that I find really interesting.

@Plantagenet no that's more than fine im happy to learn! i suppose i was using the term folklore too generally. also wow that's crazy, a lead is a lead no one wanted to seriously consider that information?

Yeeeaah, I'm an anthropologist, and studied in Canada (where Indigenous oral histories are a big deal), and I am Not Impressed. Changing "oration" (defined as a formal public speech) to "oral narration" (defined as spoken fictional or non-fictional storytelling) doesn't actually fix the fact that a "skilled Dusthide historian" is described as inaccurately preserving historical events.

I get that the devs are trying to incorporate Indigenous traditions and experiences into the lore lately, but in order to do so respectfully, a little more research is needed. The fact that a quick online search of "oral history" immediately brings up results talking about how accurate yet discriminated-against the tradition is... that's not a good look here.

To add on: If the devs want to emphasize Dusthides' talkative and sociable behaviour, while also including the concept of oral histories, perhaps they could instead write something about Dusthides passing around/down personal happenings. For example, a funny joke or prank between friends (which could be considered inconsequential in the grand scheme of things) ends up being enshrined in a story passed down through the generations. Just a thought!

[quote name="@Aequorin" date="2024-04-17 15:29:45" ] Hi @/SpectralDragon, thank you for your feedback! I wanted to let you know that we've updated the Dusthide Dragons breed article to clarify and better reflect their oral traditions. [/quote] Wow! I didn't expect this to get noticed so quickly! I'm glad to hear that I could help some. [emoji=tundra happy size=1]