ITT: People who have no idea how game development works
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TOPIC | How do y'all feel about the Pokemon Tree
Honestly i dont mind that we cant transfer all like 900+ pokemon??? Maybe the national dex will come later. Everyone needs to calm down. :/
back in my day we only had about 250 pokemon total and we were happy lmao
Honestly i dont mind that we cant transfer all like 900+ pokemon??? Maybe the national dex will come later. Everyone needs to calm down. :/
back in my day we only had about 250 pokemon total and we were happy lmao
So, why can't they just use the existing models for Gen 1 - 7 Pokémon? I thought future-proofing them was the purpose of making them so detailed (to the point that the 3DS had trouble with the games, I might add), so they could just be upscaled for when Pokémon moved to Switch?
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
At this point, though: if, for some reason, adding the old Pokémon would be hard/impossible to do without creating crunch & they couldn't push the release back for whatever reason... then I'd rather none of them make it in and just have Gen 8 be a hard reboot of the franchise.
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
At this point, though: if, for some reason, adding the old Pokémon would be hard/impossible to do without creating crunch & they couldn't push the release back for whatever reason... then I'd rather none of them make it in and just have Gen 8 be a hard reboot of the franchise.
So, why can't they just use the existing models for Gen 1 - 7 Pokémon? I thought future-proofing them was the purpose of making them so detailed (to the point that the 3DS had trouble with the games, I might add), so they could just be upscaled for when Pokémon moved to Switch?
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
At this point, though: if, for some reason, adding the old Pokémon would be hard/impossible to do without creating crunch & they couldn't push the release back for whatever reason... then I'd rather none of them make it in and just have Gen 8 be a hard reboot of the franchise.
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
At this point, though: if, for some reason, adding the old Pokémon would be hard/impossible to do without creating crunch & they couldn't push the release back for whatever reason... then I'd rather none of them make it in and just have Gen 8 be a hard reboot of the franchise.
[quote name="Dreamson" date="2019-06-13 10:58:59" ]
@Denryu
What they did to megas was a tragedy. Such a good idea wasted simply because they didn't want to put the effort in :(
[/quote]
agreeeeeed
Dreamson wrote on 2019-06-13 10:58:59:
@Denryu
What they did to megas was a tragedy. Such a good idea wasted simply because they didn't want to put the effort in :(
What they did to megas was a tragedy. Such a good idea wasted simply because they didn't want to put the effort in :(
agreeeeeed
Don't be so harsh with GF, they are just a A small indie company that has limited resources to work with., they try to bring us games that have the most ammount of content posible, obviously without rushing.
They are working on high quality animations too!
I mean, just take a look to see these detailed, breathtaking graphics that would put any2009 next gen game to shame!
Cutting half if not more of all avaliable pokemon from the game? pfff, they obviously did it for balancing imo, it's not like rulesets exist or whatever. besides, who cares about the same old pokemon? just play the old games lol also, they would have to make new models and animations for all pokemon again.Plus, too much pokemon in one game would make the size file Big, almost 8GB!, also they do this to have good optimisation. like just trust em' on this one., just make some sense, no one will notice the change.
They are working on high quality animations too!
I mean, just take a look to see these detailed, breathtaking graphics that would put any
Cutting half if not more of all avaliable pokemon from the game? pfff, they obviously did it for balancing imo, it's not like rulesets exist or whatever. besides, who cares about the same old pokemon? just play the old games lol also, they would have to make new models and animations for all pokemon again.Plus, too much pokemon in one game would make the size file Big, almost 8GB!, also they do this to have good optimisation. like just trust em' on this one., just make some sense, no one will notice the change.
Don't be so harsh with GF, they are just a A small indie company that has limited resources to work with., they try to bring us games that have the most ammount of content posible, obviously without rushing.
They are working on high quality animations too!
I mean, just take a look to see these detailed, breathtaking graphics that would put any2009 next gen game to shame!
Cutting half if not more of all avaliable pokemon from the game? pfff, they obviously did it for balancing imo, it's not like rulesets exist or whatever. besides, who cares about the same old pokemon? just play the old games lol also, they would have to make new models and animations for all pokemon again.Plus, too much pokemon in one game would make the size file Big, almost 8GB!, also they do this to have good optimisation. like just trust em' on this one., just make some sense, no one will notice the change.
They are working on high quality animations too!
I mean, just take a look to see these detailed, breathtaking graphics that would put any
Cutting half if not more of all avaliable pokemon from the game? pfff, they obviously did it for balancing imo, it's not like rulesets exist or whatever. besides, who cares about the same old pokemon? just play the old games lol also, they would have to make new models and animations for all pokemon again.Plus, too much pokemon in one game would make the size file Big, almost 8GB!, also they do this to have good optimisation. like just trust em' on this one., just make some sense, no one will notice the change.
Looking for some art for your dragons? click down below!
i think they could fit them all into s/s if they really wanted but that doesnt solve the question of what to do when you really cant fit them all in anymore some day.
im not buying mainline games since sun/moon so idc. (the price tag difference for less pokemon than the 3ds title is not nice for buyers though.) was really disappointed with gen 7 games and the direction they headed towards with pokemon so im just sitting here waiting for a new pmd/spin off title. shrug.
pokemon sells no matter what so they wont change their design philosophy. im not saying to stop voicing criticism or anything.
what made me really stare is that your pokemon cant follow you in s/s though. youd think after lets go that feature would be there. my bf collects games and would normally buy both so even i would play a bit for as long as im entertained but even he doesnt want to buy them anymore.
maybe controversial opinion but i think people would rather have all pokemon than huge maps you run through once to get through the game. after all content is done its just battles/breeding/shiny hunting/complete dex/old pokemon you love. features that need as many pokemon as possible.
im not buying mainline games since sun/moon so idc. (the price tag difference for less pokemon than the 3ds title is not nice for buyers though.) was really disappointed with gen 7 games and the direction they headed towards with pokemon so im just sitting here waiting for a new pmd/spin off title. shrug.
pokemon sells no matter what so they wont change their design philosophy. im not saying to stop voicing criticism or anything.
what made me really stare is that your pokemon cant follow you in s/s though. youd think after lets go that feature would be there. my bf collects games and would normally buy both so even i would play a bit for as long as im entertained but even he doesnt want to buy them anymore.
maybe controversial opinion but i think people would rather have all pokemon than huge maps you run through once to get through the game. after all content is done its just battles/breeding/shiny hunting/complete dex/old pokemon you love. features that need as many pokemon as possible.
i think they could fit them all into s/s if they really wanted but that doesnt solve the question of what to do when you really cant fit them all in anymore some day.
im not buying mainline games since sun/moon so idc. (the price tag difference for less pokemon than the 3ds title is not nice for buyers though.) was really disappointed with gen 7 games and the direction they headed towards with pokemon so im just sitting here waiting for a new pmd/spin off title. shrug.
pokemon sells no matter what so they wont change their design philosophy. im not saying to stop voicing criticism or anything.
what made me really stare is that your pokemon cant follow you in s/s though. youd think after lets go that feature would be there. my bf collects games and would normally buy both so even i would play a bit for as long as im entertained but even he doesnt want to buy them anymore.
maybe controversial opinion but i think people would rather have all pokemon than huge maps you run through once to get through the game. after all content is done its just battles/breeding/shiny hunting/complete dex/old pokemon you love. features that need as many pokemon as possible.
im not buying mainline games since sun/moon so idc. (the price tag difference for less pokemon than the 3ds title is not nice for buyers though.) was really disappointed with gen 7 games and the direction they headed towards with pokemon so im just sitting here waiting for a new pmd/spin off title. shrug.
pokemon sells no matter what so they wont change their design philosophy. im not saying to stop voicing criticism or anything.
what made me really stare is that your pokemon cant follow you in s/s though. youd think after lets go that feature would be there. my bf collects games and would normally buy both so even i would play a bit for as long as im entertained but even he doesnt want to buy them anymore.
maybe controversial opinion but i think people would rather have all pokemon than huge maps you run through once to get through the game. after all content is done its just battles/breeding/shiny hunting/complete dex/old pokemon you love. features that need as many pokemon as possible.
[quote name="Seadramon" date="2019-06-13 13:36:48" ]
So, why can't they just use the existing models for Gen 1 - 7 Pokémon? I thought future-proofing them was the purpose of making them so detailed (to the point that the 3DS had trouble with the games, I might add), so they could just be upscaled for when Pokémon moved to Switch?
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
[/quote]
Impossible to say for sure, but I can say it’s very, very complicated.
My best guess? Sw/sh is an open world game, using the BotW engine from the looks of it. That [i]could[/i] mean that even the art assets and rigging created for the Switch game Lets Go are not importable to sw/sh.
A hypothetical scenario is that GF/Nintendo plan their games several years before production begins (think about it, they need to hire and educate staff who can use all the latest software and co-ordinate with the rest of the franchise branches like the anime and tradiong cards, ect ect ect). But at that point there’s no way to know for sure what stage future engines will be at - even if they were hoping to be able to use the BotW engine to create an open world Pokémon, it might’ve been much more realistic to prepare for a game more similar to Lets Go (which was probably an experiment made to solve a bunch of design problems in preparation for sw/sh to begin with, hence its simplified gameplay - and reduced burden of game design).
In short - the art assets were possibly prepared anew at LEAST from the rigging stage, or even from the modeling stage because they prepared the gen 7 assets for the Lets Go engine, and not the BotW engine they ended up using. Then, this is a trade-off we get in exchange for an open world Pokémon game.
Seadramon wrote on 2019-06-13 13:36:48:
So, why can't they just use the existing models for Gen 1 - 7 Pokémon? I thought future-proofing them was the purpose of making them so detailed (to the point that the 3DS had trouble with the games, I might add), so they could just be upscaled for when Pokémon moved to Switch?
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
I mean, looking at the models of non-Gen 8 Pokémon shown in the Treehouse footage, I'd believe that's what they were doing since the models & animations look the exact same as they did in the 3DS games, just at a higher resolution. So wha happun?
My best guess? Sw/sh is an open world game, using the BotW engine from the looks of it. That could mean that even the art assets and rigging created for the Switch game Lets Go are not importable to sw/sh.
A hypothetical scenario is that GF/Nintendo plan their games several years before production begins (think about it, they need to hire and educate staff who can use all the latest software and co-ordinate with the rest of the franchise branches like the anime and tradiong cards, ect ect ect). But at that point there’s no way to know for sure what stage future engines will be at - even if they were hoping to be able to use the BotW engine to create an open world Pokémon, it might’ve been much more realistic to prepare for a game more similar to Lets Go (which was probably an experiment made to solve a bunch of design problems in preparation for sw/sh to begin with, hence its simplified gameplay - and reduced burden of game design).
In short - the art assets were possibly prepared anew at LEAST from the rigging stage, or even from the modeling stage because they prepared the gen 7 assets for the Lets Go engine, and not the BotW engine they ended up using. Then, this is a trade-off we get in exchange for an open world Pokémon game.
...didn't they do this with black and white? make it so you could only get unova pokemon? (i didn't play bw past the tutorial so i might be wrong)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
...didn't they do this with black and white? make it so you could only get unova pokemon? (i didn't play bw past the tutorial so i might be wrong)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
back after a VERY long break
+3 fr time
Let’s do some math:
There are currently 807 Pokémon in existence (not counting those in Gen 8.) You’d think that, because you can reuse models and animations, the workload is only that of the new Pokémon. But what if you wanted to add new animations, like maybe a weakened animation when they’re at low health? That’s 807 animations on top of the 100 or so new Pokémon being added. Want Pokémon to follow behind you? 907 walking animations. Want a new feature where you can, say, play soccer with your Pokémon? That’s all the animations necessary for that feature (kicking, celebrating, etc) times 907. That’s an insane number of animations.
Technically yes, Pokémon has reused models and animations since XY, but this exponential problem means that in order for development time/money (artists are costly and money isn’t infinite) to also not grow exponentially, Pokemon can never introduce any new features that require it to add more animations to the pokemon.
Game Freak made a call and said they’d rather be free to make those features. Based on their comments about “expressiveness” my guess is that they’re updating Amie with new activities/animations/etc. And even if you still think they can do it at 907ish Pokémon, at what point does that number get too large? 1000? 1100? 2000? What happens when the models need to be updated for new graphic improvements? It was bound to happen eventually.
There are currently 807 Pokémon in existence (not counting those in Gen 8.) You’d think that, because you can reuse models and animations, the workload is only that of the new Pokémon. But what if you wanted to add new animations, like maybe a weakened animation when they’re at low health? That’s 807 animations on top of the 100 or so new Pokémon being added. Want Pokémon to follow behind you? 907 walking animations. Want a new feature where you can, say, play soccer with your Pokémon? That’s all the animations necessary for that feature (kicking, celebrating, etc) times 907. That’s an insane number of animations.
Technically yes, Pokémon has reused models and animations since XY, but this exponential problem means that in order for development time/money (artists are costly and money isn’t infinite) to also not grow exponentially, Pokemon can never introduce any new features that require it to add more animations to the pokemon.
Game Freak made a call and said they’d rather be free to make those features. Based on their comments about “expressiveness” my guess is that they’re updating Amie with new activities/animations/etc. And even if you still think they can do it at 907ish Pokémon, at what point does that number get too large? 1000? 1100? 2000? What happens when the models need to be updated for new graphic improvements? It was bound to happen eventually.
Let’s do some math:
There are currently 807 Pokémon in existence (not counting those in Gen 8.) You’d think that, because you can reuse models and animations, the workload is only that of the new Pokémon. But what if you wanted to add new animations, like maybe a weakened animation when they’re at low health? That’s 807 animations on top of the 100 or so new Pokémon being added. Want Pokémon to follow behind you? 907 walking animations. Want a new feature where you can, say, play soccer with your Pokémon? That’s all the animations necessary for that feature (kicking, celebrating, etc) times 907. That’s an insane number of animations.
Technically yes, Pokémon has reused models and animations since XY, but this exponential problem means that in order for development time/money (artists are costly and money isn’t infinite) to also not grow exponentially, Pokemon can never introduce any new features that require it to add more animations to the pokemon.
Game Freak made a call and said they’d rather be free to make those features. Based on their comments about “expressiveness” my guess is that they’re updating Amie with new activities/animations/etc. And even if you still think they can do it at 907ish Pokémon, at what point does that number get too large? 1000? 1100? 2000? What happens when the models need to be updated for new graphic improvements? It was bound to happen eventually.
There are currently 807 Pokémon in existence (not counting those in Gen 8.) You’d think that, because you can reuse models and animations, the workload is only that of the new Pokémon. But what if you wanted to add new animations, like maybe a weakened animation when they’re at low health? That’s 807 animations on top of the 100 or so new Pokémon being added. Want Pokémon to follow behind you? 907 walking animations. Want a new feature where you can, say, play soccer with your Pokémon? That’s all the animations necessary for that feature (kicking, celebrating, etc) times 907. That’s an insane number of animations.
Technically yes, Pokémon has reused models and animations since XY, but this exponential problem means that in order for development time/money (artists are costly and money isn’t infinite) to also not grow exponentially, Pokemon can never introduce any new features that require it to add more animations to the pokemon.
Game Freak made a call and said they’d rather be free to make those features. Based on their comments about “expressiveness” my guess is that they’re updating Amie with new activities/animations/etc. And even if you still think they can do it at 907ish Pokémon, at what point does that number get too large? 1000? 1100? 2000? What happens when the models need to be updated for new graphic improvements? It was bound to happen eventually.
[quote name="eiskaffee" date="2019-06-13 14:49:39" ]
...didn't they do this with black and white? make it so you could only get unova pokemon? (i didn't play bw past the tutorial so i might be wrong)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
[/quote]
[center][color=brown]yeah, i thiiiink black and white did this? and it was fine (imo). i recall you being able to catch all other pokemon post game but i could be wrong. i'm hoping they add them eventually. it is on the switch so they can update it however they see fit, like how they are adding smash characters onto the roster even after the game got released.
eiskaffee wrote on 2019-06-13 14:49:39:
...didn't they do this with black and white? make it so you could only get unova pokemon? (i didn't play bw past the tutorial so i might be wrong)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
i personally like it when they don't let you catch all the pokemon because i want to focus on the new ones, not catch a pikachu for the five-hundreth time.
and i'm sure they'll have cross-compatibility with the pokemon bank, so people can maintain their collection
(i haven't been keeping up with pokemon too much)
yeah, i thiiiink black and white did this? and it was fine (imo). i recall you being able to catch all other pokemon post game but i could be wrong. i'm hoping they add them eventually. it is on the switch so they can update it however they see fit, like how they are adding smash characters onto the roster even after the game got released.
