Final Update
Hello, everyone! After taking a break from this thread for several days (I haven't read it since my last post in this thread) and giving it some careful thought, I've come to the conclusion that I'm going to give up managing this thread. It's become a source of anxiety for me to the point of losing sleep and feeling physically nauseous, and when it comes down to it, this is not as important as other things I could and should be putting my efforts and attention into.
Of course, everyone is still free to read and post here. I still believe in these items and would LOVE to see them come into reality! After all, the time for "randomness" is at the time of a dragon's hatching. After the base (the dragon) has been generated, the user should be allowed to customize said dragon (heck, we can even change eye type in a controlled way (Dark Sclera, Glowing, Swirl, Innocent) if we don't like the ones the dragon hatched with) with the base as a jumping-off point. Already, if we provide enough dragoncash, we can change eye type, genes, and breed in a controlled way, and these accentuate the breeding aspect of the game. "I want a dragon with this gene. I'll put this expensive gene on the other parent so that this particular gene has a greater chance of coming up." Or even "I want this specific color combination and I can get parents who have the same colors so when I breed them, their kids have a 100% chance of getting these colors." These are ways in which items help breeding already and how color-picking already exists in the game. Anyway, this sort of stuff is explained in other posts, so I won't take up space here.
Since I'm not going to be working on this thread anymore, I won't be updating anything, and so I won't be pinging anyone (apologies to those who looked forward to pings!) I also won't be collecting tallies anymore, so you'll have to wade through the thread yourself from here on out to collect data. (Again, sorry!) From the data already collected, however, it's clear that the claim that "no one will ever support an idea like this" is completely false and is only propagated by either the misinformed or those who want to keep the game from improving for other players because things as they are work well for them. It's important to beware generalized statements like this in any case. Painting things with a broad brush is rarely entirely accurate. (Just a tip.)
I want to thank everyone who contributed to this thread in a positive way. That includes people who supported the idea, yes, but also anyone who contributed an idea, contributed constructive criticism, anyone who compromised, and especially anyone who was respectful, even if in the end, they disagreed with this idea. Thank you for making FR great by being upstanding people!
Again, I want to discourage rudeness and harshness on this thread, not that I'm going to be moderating it. Respect is paramount, especially when there's disagreement. We're not each other's enemies.
And finally, I want to talk about specific, unhelpful kinds of posts for the suggestions forum in general.
1. Disapproving the idea for EVERYONE just because you wouldn't use the items. (No one is making you use them. No need to disallow others to enjoy it just because you wouldn't use it. It's like if I said "I'm not going to use that accent so it shouldn't exist." There's no sense in it.)
2. Becoming livid right off the bat. (Saying things like "This is a terrible idea! You should never suggest something like this! I'll never support something as dumb as this!" and such is rude, unhelpful, and doesn't take into account that the other user is trying to fix a problem that that user faces in the game. Consider the other person's feelings; not just your own desires.)
3. Defending the status quo for the sake of defending the status quo. (The suggestions forums is for bringing new and fresh takes to how to improve the game overall. Just because an idea, if actualized, would disrupt your normal doesn't justify shooting it down and dragging down the thread. You have no intention of discussing the idea if all you want to do is shoot it down, so don't contribute. If you have a way to improve the idea or have concerns you want to bring up in a respectful way for the other side to think about to help the idea achieve its best state then by all means, speak up!)
4. Jumping to conclusions. (If someone says something that sets you off, it's better to calm down before posting again. Then, calmly tell the person what you think the other person said or meant and ask if it is accurate. You may be pleasantly surprised to find that you misunderstood the other person! But you also need to be open to this possibility. If you've already decided that someone's greedy or mean or whatever else, that's all you'll ever see the other person as. Give them a chance! You may even find that you really respect the other person!)
Obviously, I don't control anyone, and these are just suggestions. I can't stop you from behaving in ways that are toxic to other players and that chase them out of the Suggestions Forum. However, I can make my suggestions, so here they are. Of course, not everyone who disagreed with this idea conformed to one of these three types of unhelpful posts, but it happened enough that I'm leaving this part of the forums behind. I don't think that this is most people's goal, so I thought I'd give some food for thought.
...And a reminder from the Suggestion Forum Policy.
Anyway, thank you all, and I hope that things go well for you. :)
Hello, everyone! After taking a break from this thread for several days (I haven't read it since my last post in this thread) and giving it some careful thought, I've come to the conclusion that I'm going to give up managing this thread. It's become a source of anxiety for me to the point of losing sleep and feeling physically nauseous, and when it comes down to it, this is not as important as other things I could and should be putting my efforts and attention into.
Of course, everyone is still free to read and post here. I still believe in these items and would LOVE to see them come into reality! After all, the time for "randomness" is at the time of a dragon's hatching. After the base (the dragon) has been generated, the user should be allowed to customize said dragon (heck, we can even change eye type in a controlled way (Dark Sclera, Glowing, Swirl, Innocent) if we don't like the ones the dragon hatched with) with the base as a jumping-off point. Already, if we provide enough dragoncash, we can change eye type, genes, and breed in a controlled way, and these accentuate the breeding aspect of the game. "I want a dragon with this gene. I'll put this expensive gene on the other parent so that this particular gene has a greater chance of coming up." Or even "I want this specific color combination and I can get parents who have the same colors so when I breed them, their kids have a 100% chance of getting these colors." These are ways in which items help breeding already and how color-picking already exists in the game. Anyway, this sort of stuff is explained in other posts, so I won't take up space here.
Since I'm not going to be working on this thread anymore, I won't be updating anything, and so I won't be pinging anyone (apologies to those who looked forward to pings!) I also won't be collecting tallies anymore, so you'll have to wade through the thread yourself from here on out to collect data. (Again, sorry!) From the data already collected, however, it's clear that the claim that "no one will ever support an idea like this" is completely false and is only propagated by either the misinformed or those who want to keep the game from improving for other players because things as they are work well for them. It's important to beware generalized statements like this in any case. Painting things with a broad brush is rarely entirely accurate. (Just a tip.)
I want to thank everyone who contributed to this thread in a positive way. That includes people who supported the idea, yes, but also anyone who contributed an idea, contributed constructive criticism, anyone who compromised, and especially anyone who was respectful, even if in the end, they disagreed with this idea. Thank you for making FR great by being upstanding people!
Again, I want to discourage rudeness and harshness on this thread, not that I'm going to be moderating it. Respect is paramount, especially when there's disagreement. We're not each other's enemies.
And finally, I want to talk about specific, unhelpful kinds of posts for the suggestions forum in general.
1. Disapproving the idea for EVERYONE just because you wouldn't use the items. (No one is making you use them. No need to disallow others to enjoy it just because you wouldn't use it. It's like if I said "I'm not going to use that accent so it shouldn't exist." There's no sense in it.)
2. Becoming livid right off the bat. (Saying things like "This is a terrible idea! You should never suggest something like this! I'll never support something as dumb as this!" and such is rude, unhelpful, and doesn't take into account that the other user is trying to fix a problem that that user faces in the game. Consider the other person's feelings; not just your own desires.)
3. Defending the status quo for the sake of defending the status quo. (The suggestions forums is for bringing new and fresh takes to how to improve the game overall. Just because an idea, if actualized, would disrupt your normal doesn't justify shooting it down and dragging down the thread. You have no intention of discussing the idea if all you want to do is shoot it down, so don't contribute. If you have a way to improve the idea or have concerns you want to bring up in a respectful way for the other side to think about to help the idea achieve its best state then by all means, speak up!)
4. Jumping to conclusions. (If someone says something that sets you off, it's better to calm down before posting again. Then, calmly tell the person what you think the other person said or meant and ask if it is accurate. You may be pleasantly surprised to find that you misunderstood the other person! But you also need to be open to this possibility. If you've already decided that someone's greedy or mean or whatever else, that's all you'll ever see the other person as. Give them a chance! You may even find that you really respect the other person!)
Obviously, I don't control anyone, and these are just suggestions. I can't stop you from behaving in ways that are toxic to other players and that chase them out of the Suggestions Forum. However, I can make my suggestions, so here they are. Of course, not everyone who disagreed with this idea conformed to one of these three types of unhelpful posts, but it happened enough that I'm leaving this part of the forums behind. I don't think that this is most people's goal, so I thought I'd give some food for thought.
...And a reminder from the Suggestion Forum Policy.
Quote:
Be considerate of your fellow players, and especially of new players. This isn’t a popularity contest. Build each other and your ideas up, don’t tear each other down.
If you don’t like a suggestion, you are not required to comment on it. We encourage our players to not comment on suggestions they dislike.
Do not attempt to shut down or “end” a suggestion you personally disagree with or dislike. If you feel you are able to have a constructive discussion regarding a suggestion you disagree with or do not want to see, that is okay.
Please do not attempt to speak for or on behalf of the development team in an effort to stifle the discussion. We appreciate that our players are attentive to how we have approached certain suggestions in the past, but we would rather a discussion continue to develop, barring forum moderation or enforcement of our Terms, rules, or policies. Please remember that the decision to implement or not implement a suggestion is ours.
If you don’t like a suggestion, you are not required to comment on it. We encourage our players to not comment on suggestions they dislike.
Do not attempt to shut down or “end” a suggestion you personally disagree with or dislike. If you feel you are able to have a constructive discussion regarding a suggestion you disagree with or do not want to see, that is okay.
Please do not attempt to speak for or on behalf of the development team in an effort to stifle the discussion. We appreciate that our players are attentive to how we have approached certain suggestions in the past, but we would rather a discussion continue to develop, barring forum moderation or enforcement of our Terms, rules, or policies. Please remember that the decision to implement or not implement a suggestion is ours.
Anyway, thank you all, and I hope that things go well for you. :)
I don't know if this has already been suggested or not, but what about a set of specialty items which allows you to bump one of a dragon's colors up or down the color wheel by one? They can be expensive gem items, but I'd love for them to exist! They would make breeding projects a lot less tedious, and take some pain out of g1 hatches that aren't quite right.
The items would be something like: Primary Color Booster, Primary Color Droplet, Secondary Color Booster, Secondary Color Droplet, Tertiary Color Booster, and Tertiary Color Droplet.
The booster would move the color up the wheel by 1, and the droplets would move the color down the wheel by 1. So, for example, you use a droplet on a Pearl dragon, it would become Maize. But if you used a booster on the Pearl dragon, it would become Rose. ONLY on the corresponding position (primary/secondary/tertiary) however.
This keeps the player from truly customizing a dragon, but it relieves some of the pain of hatching that g1 with near-perfect colors, or breeding a pair again and again and always getting hatchlings 1-off from your goal.
UPDATE!
A modification to this idea was proposed here which may resolve the concerns of the g1 market being flooded by XXX/XXY/etc. dragons.
Ettanin wrote on 2020-06-21 13:27:08:
Tentative under the condition that the following color patterns are impossible to obtain using the suggested items:
XXX (Targeted color will not shift to match the other, skipping it on the color wheel.)
XXY (Item will not shift the color in this direction, skipping it on the wheel if targeted)
XYX (Item will not shift the color in this direction, skipping it on the wheel if targeted)
XYY (Item will not shift the color in this direction, skipping it on the wheel if targeted)
That way it's a breeding project assistant item and it can be used to make g1 dragons less of an eyesore while still avoiding damage to the economy.
XXX (Targeted color will not shift to match the other, skipping it on the color wheel.)
XXY (Item will not shift the color in this direction, skipping it on the wheel if targeted)
XYX (Item will not shift the color in this direction, skipping it on the wheel if targeted)
XYY (Item will not shift the color in this direction, skipping it on the wheel if targeted)
That way it's a breeding project assistant item and it can be used to make g1 dragons less of an eyesore while still avoiding damage to the economy.
The call for opinions on this was made here.
Another UPDATE!
Time for ver3 of these items! Some very helpful suggestions for improving these items were made! So, here's the newly-adjusted items! (This builds upon ver1 and ver2 of the items instead of replacing them.)
Before wrote on 2020-07-28 11:35:28:
As for trading and such, it would be best if it was clear on the dragon's profile page. In fact, whether or not there are limited uses, making it clear on the profile that the dragon's color had been changed would make it not affect the market as much. Yeah, some people who want XXX Gen Is would be able to get them easier (assuming staff don't go with the skip-that-color suggestion), but if you want a true XXX Gen I, it's just as difficult as always.
Mockup using Inspect Element:
That at least would make me neutral towards it, even if there wasn't a limited number of times you could use it. It would make it so you can get what you want, but it doesn't take away perceived value from those dragons that were born with desirable colors.
Mockup using Inspect Element:
That at least would make me neutral towards it, even if there wasn't a limited number of times you could use it. It would make it so you can get what you want, but it doesn't take away perceived value from those dragons that were born with desirable colors.
In addition to the number of uses of which items being visible in the dragon's page, I would also have it be that you can "erase" this by using the opposing items to return a dragon to its original colors. For example, in the mockup provided by Before, 1 booster was used. If the user wanted to get rid of that note, he or she could use a droplet to counteract the booster, and since the dragon would have returned to its original colors, the message would disappear.
ALSO!
monkfishlover wrote on 2020-07-27 16:32:29:
maybe there could be a cooldown on purchasing it so u have to wait like 30 days to use it on the same dragon again
This is the original suggestion, but I'd do a slight riff on it (since, really, it's talking about 2 kinds of cooldowns with the wording of "same dragon" in the second part.) I'd say that there should be a purchase cooldown, much like with Joxar's chest. Being able to purchase 1 droplet OR booster per month would discourage users from mass-buying, as the lock will be on the account itself, not on the dragon. Otherwise, if you had enough money, you could buy a bunch and just wait for the dragon to cooldown, or apply a bunch to multiple dragons, which seems contrary to what those who oppose the items want. I also see this as being more obviously a tool for breeding than the pervious versions since it lines up pretty well with breeding cooldowns.
If you're breeding a pair of Coatl trying to get a specific color and want to narrow the color range, you can do so once per nest. If you're breeding a couple Mirrors with the same intent, you can do so once per two nests. And if you're kind of poor on FR (as opposed to the rich, who would be the ones supposedly flooding the markets), then you won't mind the cooldown since you need that time to build up the funds with which to purchase the items anyway.
I know it's not ideal for those of us who want these items to be a thing, but we need to be considerate of EVERYONE's interests. Plus, if you love your dragon enough to have held onto him or her with no way of changing his or her colors besides scattering (which you're unwilling to do or just came off of doing) then waiting for a cooldown shouldn't be that bad. :)
The call for opinions on this was made here.
Tallies
Before the first proposed adjustment, the tallies came to 8 for and 9 against.
The tally for the ver2 items is 9 for and 9 against.
The tally for the ver3 items is currently 3 for and 1 against.
Please note that the update below only came into being during ver.3 and did not exist for versions 1 and 2:
IMPORTANT NOTE
If you ask me not to ping you here, I will respect your wishes BUT you forfeit your vote on the current version of the items and any future versions. This is because, while I value your opinion, you are asking to be removed from the process of improving and/or mulling over this idea and, in fact, the entire project (including your own potential contributions, which includes votes.) Another reason is because if there are any misconceptions, I cannot address them if I cannot ping you, hence informed decisions cannot be made. Your votes (if they were cast) for all previous versions will remain intact.
The List of Those Who Wish Not to be Pinged:
-snipped-
cillian || adult || he/they
