Flight Rising Discussion

[quote name="@Aliandrin" date="2023-01-13 12:57:18" ] [quote name="Almedha" date="2023-01-13 12:42:38" ]But even if you grant this is a "native/conqueror" story, you're right yours is certainly an option. Though I was imagining us each in the position of the staff - we have the ability to rewrite the world and reinterpret it without retconning anything, rather than the authors of individual clans in a world set up for us. This opens tons of options beyond the "onlys." As the authors of individual clans, yeah, our options are significantly more limited. The dragons don't have anywhere else to go. The beastclans don't have anywhere else to go. And even if they did - this is literally the homeland of both groups. It's possible that's the desired outcome if this is an allegory: that the dragons give up everything to the beastclans, including their lives. If that's what the staff thinks the outcome of this allegory [i]should be[/i], I can totally see why they wouldn't write that.[/quote] That's what I think the outcome should be, unless the dragons can bring back the dead. If they actually want to make it right, we are going to reach a place where the dragons have given up everything they can (and still live) and either the beastclans are going to want more or the dragons will offer more, because I don't believe [i]nobody[/i] is capable of seeing the plain-as-day fact that it wasn't enough. Somebody is going to figure that out, that it wasn't enough, and that to do more, the dragons have to leave. For good. Since I didn't want that, the best story I could come up with for my clan that is not a retcon is still something that absolves my dragons of blame, because if they had really done those things, they would owe everything and more. You know what I came up with? My dragons are shade creatures. They never committed racism. They just slaughtered everyone equally. And because they're [u]not[/u] dragons, except their husks, they're not to blame for what dragons did and even though what they did was pretty bad, they can actually overcome it. Pure evil shade creatures. That kill indiscriminately. This is what I came up with because it's [i]better[/i]. This is what I came up with because now, my clan is in a place where they can overcome their past evil and aggression. They're not saddled with the absolutely unatoneable crimes of dragons because... they ain't dragons. And I can't help noticing that out in the real world, I am worse than a pure evil shade creature. I don't think it's a good thing to wish you were a serial killer because that's better. The staff may not have intended it but that's the message they sent, loud and clear. And I don't think it's because they suck at storytelling. I think they did the right thing with the retcon. I think they're sending that message because... that's actually the truth, and a lot of truths point to it. But it's still incredibly depressing and I think they did wrong to do something that can't help but remind people... that the crimes of their ancestors can never be forgotten, repaired, or overcome. Never. Even a killer can repent but... yeah not that. You know how I know a killer can repent or even be a protagonist? Because there are stories about it.https://www1.flightrising.com/static/forum_icons/bbcode/forum_left.png No one will write the story about someone whose kind did evil, overcoming that. So I know it can't be overcome. [/quote] [i](This is [/i]not at all[i] related to the rest of the thread, but I felt like it had to be said.)[/i] Well, I'm sorry you see it that way - I don't personally agree. But, to be perfectly fair to the world at large, that story has been written, the one about being born evil. And written well. Of course, modern society might disagree. Regardless of the modern zeitgeist and the unforgiving culture we find ourselves in, I think it might be worth it to say to everyone: [b]you are not responsible for what your parents do[/b]. There is forgiveness and redemption, even outside of time travel. It doesn't take a genius to see the modern concept of personal fault for historical evils leads to unsustainable amounts of anxiety and dread. What is more dreadful than the reality you can be blamed for the actions of someone else? If my father were to go out today and commit an unspeakable crime, could I end up in prison? That's kind of what we're talking about, no? I don't think it's possible to atone for something one did not do. And I personally think we like these redemption arc stories, regardless of where or who we are, because every last one of us [i]knows we need it[/i]. We all think cruel and vicious thoughts about the people we don't like, and sometimes even about the people we do. We are jealous and greedy of the things and people we want, and both of these emotions come from a place of [i]love[/i]. Hell, we cut people off in traffic just because we weren't looking or weren't willing to let them go first - sometimes with even deadly consequences that cannot be undone. That, if for no other reason, is enough to illustrate to me that this concept of personal guilt for historical evil can never end. The world will [i]always[/i] have this history. There's no atoning that will make it right. And, you're right, with this framework, you can either choose to always have this guilt (to be reciprocal with the amount of time this evil will have been done... which is, of course, forever)... or you can recognize this concept isn't good for yourself and others and abandon it. Guilt and shame are powerful motivators for adjusting the course for the future, but not over the long term. You don't have to be a psychologist to agree with that. That's what the redemption arc is for: it is not to reset things to the way they "should have been." It's not about atoning, which is possibly what the staff doesn't like. It's about the future. The redemption arc is unfair. But [i]that's the point.[/i] Redemption arcs do not happen to good people. Good people don't need redemption. Redemption is intrinsically an acknowledgement of actions as evil (and evil as a bad thing, which feels stupid to have to say, but we live here...). But even this actually doesn't [i]only[/i] mean one thing. It means one of two things: the dragons are [i]not[/i] evil and do not need redemption (because this isn't allowed) or the dragons [i]are[/i] evil. But they do not need redemption. Fortunately, we live in the real world where the redemption is there only for the taking of it. [b]You are not what others say. You are not who your parents are.[/b]

[quote name="@Alize" date="2023-01-13 13:43:20" ] Correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldn't this type of stuff go in the Creative Corner section? The place of lore and writing and arts and crafts? [/quote] Yeah! So it seems that discussion of canon lore belongs in FRD, while more individual lore stuff belongs in Creative Corner. I usually put my canon lore thinkings in FRD and nobody seems to ever bat an eye at it. While Creative Corner seems more suited to individual stories - either of clans or dragons. I could totally see an argument both ways, but this doesn't really seem to conform to the typical stuff in Creative Corner. I could be wrong, but this is like. Years of dodging under the radar by just about everyone (including those weekly lore threads of yore that used to pop up here) if this isn't true, I guess.