Suggestions

Hold onto your hats folks, this one may be difficult to implement, I'm no coder, but it's an idea I've had for a while let's go.

One of my main complaints about fr is the heavy coli focus, it's hard for me to grind simply because of my ADD. Because of this I find my self low on food and missing out on swipp items because of the lost item income. To help with this, I propose a revamp of the gathering system that introduces a few possible things:

1. Gathering teams and turns
The player is given the choice of two dragons from their lair to send gathering. A new player will send both of their progens while larger lairs unlock more slots as their lair expands say one dragon slot per page or something like that.
The more dragons you send to gather, the more food, materials, etc. they bring back. This way the amount of food one can get from gathering is roughly proportional to the number of dragons in the lair.
In this system each dragon slot has a set number of turns such that their total number for a beginner is 12 per day and the maximum is not abundantly high. Turns are distributed to all the gathering dragons.

2. Gathering levels
Rather than having a gathering level for the whole lair, each dragon is given their own gathering level for a specific discipline. As their level increases the rarity of the items they gather does also as well as the chance of tethering rare familiars etc.
This adds anothe dimension to the dragon market as a high level fisherman brings special value.
It also adds lore opportunity for players wishing to develop stories and personalities for their dragons.

3. Specialization
Different switches which allow a specific dragon to
"Gather" - Bring back a random distribution of items
"Search for food" - Bring back food items not used in swipp trades
"Search for swipp" - Bring back items used for swipp trades (slightly smaller haul)
"Search for rare" - Bring back rare items such as gathering familiars, eggs, or chests
Swipp and rare options would come with stipulations which prevent abuse. For instance a rare search may exhaust all of a dragon's turns for a day as well as yield nothing at all.

4. Provisions for festivals
Drop rates for festival currency and chests would be standard across lair sizes such that everyone has a fair chance at getting items regardless of how many expansions they have. However, higher level gatherers will be able to pull in more the same way having a high level coli team greatly improves ones festival performance.

5. Dom bonuses
Dom bonuses would give extra turns to the lair as always. Additionally dominance could give improved gathering stats to dragons of that Element the same way coli fighters receive a boost.

So that turned rather long. Let me know what you guys think.

No support for tying the gathering to the number of dragons. It should depend on the gathering level, as it is now. I can support the addititional bonus appearing on a new gathering level - e.g., no less than a stack of 2 on lvl 10 (excluding high-tier items and familiars), no less than 2 slots of items on lvl 20, 3 slots on lvl 30, min 3 items on 40. Then no lair will ever go hungry if their gathering level is high, and no more 1 blade of grass on lvl 40 anymore.

The system you're proposing is, tbh, just too complicated. I just want to do 15 clicks and get my stuff, I don't want to pick certain dragons, specializations, tiers, etc. Too much work.

@Valemora

Reasonable for linking things to number of dragons, though I should have clarified it would be based on number of spaces rather than number of actual dragons if that wasn't clear. Some people choose to have small lairs and shouldn't get shafted because of it.

In response to your second criticism, a large part of this was also in turning gathering into part of the game rather than a button you have to remember to spam 15 times every day. I'd like it to become something you put active thought into rather than the "spam til you get a chest" model.

I much prefer the current system over the proposed system.

I like that the gathering is by the lair and not by individual dragons. To me it makes more sense as since the longer the clan has been established--the better the collective knowledge is of where to gather. If one dragon finds a good spot, they'd pass it onto the lair. Plus by allowing it by the lair, it doesn't penalize players who don't keep dragons for long (Nuzlock lairs, exalters, etc)

I do not think that larger lairs should get more gather turns (or opportunities to gather); its entirely possible to feed your lair with the current system--its just that many players don't dedicate turns to gathering food and thus have low levels in the food gathering categories thus don't have access to the higher food point items as they spend their time digging or scavenging and these players would continue to do so with more turns and still not be able to feed their lair.

I'd rather not see the option to specify search for swipp or search for rare---even with checks it would likely devalue these things too much and even if it didn't do that, too many players would likely use these option in an attempt to profit and once again be unable to feed their dragons via gathering.

No thank you for higher levelled gathers getting more festival currency. I like that gathering is equal for any player when it comes to festivals.


I will admit the gathering system does need some adjustment as although it does ‘level up’ the way it currently works can punish a player for leveling up by decreasing the chances of desirable items and logically it makes no sense that a high leveled clan would bring back a single item. The way gathering currently works is the system rolls which tier (star rating) to pull from, then rolls which item from that pool, then rolls the amount, then rolls to see if there is another pull. So when new items are added to the pool, they compete against items of their rarity. New items generally have a higher hoard sell value or food point value so in theory adding new more valuable items in the pool should increase the average sell value or point value brought back; but it is not at all useful when a player is searching for a particular item which is frequently the case.

Probably one of the easiest ways to improve the gathering system would be as you level up change the minimum number of pulls and minimum number of items in a stack for items that stack and possibly also increase the maximum potential pulls in the higher levels.

I personally don't think removing ‘junk’ as you level up is the way to go; because ‘junk’ is subjective. A player may collect that junk and removing it after a certain level means they wouldn’t be able to collect it themselves. In addition ‘junk’ might be given a new purpose (for example a component in Swipp or Baldwin) which means a player that has leveled out of its range would be forced to buy it.

To avoid the issue of valuable items like chests and eggs getting flooded out by other items as you level up, add them to the pool multiple times (or possibly adding them to multiple pools) so although there are more items in the pool the chances of pulling the valuable item stays the same or increases. Alternatively special items could be put in a different pulling system similar to the festival currency (in that it doesn't take up a normal pull).

Another thing that may be useful is at a certain level, you could select a particular item and it would add a few more of them into the loot table, so that it would increase your chances of finding that item and allow for a more customized gathering experience.

@DragonSage

Addressing your comments here and the comment above, perhaps scaling things to number of lair spaces does introduce imbalance, but I still believe there are plenty of redeemable aspects in this system.

A team of three gatherers each with four turns each by default, five turns each with well fed bonus and six turns each for dom bonus and well fed bonus + the gathering levels system would do quite a bit for adding another level of control and variance to game play.

Tying gathering level to individual dragons is, in my opinion, a viable option which can include fixes to handle the existing flaws in the gathering system while also, again, giving FR players more control over the dynamics of their lairs.

'Junk' items in this system would not be removed from the pool, but would yield more to rarer/more valuable items as level increased. The original idea behind the search rare etc. options was to allow players to search specifically for different ranges of their gathering spectrum such that someone who wants specifically lower level items could use the first search option to obtain only low level items. (I will admit I lost sight of this when typing up the first post, but it's here, and I'll be editing in these parts shortly)

@Llanai
However, the small lairs will get shafted in your case? They will have fewer turns, while big lairs like mine, which specialize on fodder filpping, will have lots of turns despite most dragons leaving the lair without being fed even once. Large lairs that don't feed dragons or large but empty lairs will have more turns for no apparent reason, too. There will have to be so many conditions to prevent abusing the system - feeding check, age check, etc, etc.

Moreover, the current system already allows to feed a huge lair, it only needs a bit of tweaking to prevent rng from throwing in several 2-point turns in a day. I don't coli to feed my lair yet I have 40 pages of extra food because I collect full stacks of each item.

I would love some additional games and such for whenever I'm in a mood to spend more time playing, but this thing is fast and simple to do every day, and I love it for that. I log in, spam a button, convert the food and feed the dragons, fast and easy. I'd hate to spend lots of time and thought just to feed my dragons daily as I prefer to spend the time elsewhere (e.g., on the forum), and every game gets boring eventually.

Also, there are people who change their lair completely pretty often, will they have to train the gatherers from the scratch every time? Or just whenever someone wants to get rid of the dragon that happens to be a gatherer, will the choice be between getting stuck with the dragon you don't like anymore and losing all hard-earned turns? Sounds awful.

Tying the gathering system to individual dragons will penalize players who frequently change their lair. Increasing the number of gatherers based on the number of dragons or lair spaces penalizes players who choose to have small lairs.

Gathering should remain an easy way to get food or items, and it shouldn't penalize players because they have different play styles. Your suggested system would penalize players with different play systems while the current system doesn't matter if your lair is large or small nor does it matter if you have long term residents or you frequently change your lair inhabitants.

I like this system better than the current one, though it could use edits (see below). It suits my playstyle better- I like the lore opportunities and the advancement system. The current leveling system feels... lackluster. I would appreciate more engaging gameplay and strategy, too. The current system is just 'hit a button for free stuff'. I don't want to have turns for individual dragons, or more Gathering turns for larger lairs, though. My take on the idea is as follows: [LIST=1] [*]All dragons have six Gathering stats. [*]The Gathering page has an option to 'choose your team'. You always have three slots. [*]The team has twelve Gathering stats- Quality and Quantity for each method. These are displayed next to the team. [*]Quantity increases the number of stacks and the number of items in each stack. Teamwork helps, i.e. two dragons with 10 Fishing have more Fishing Quantity than one dragon with 20. [*]Quality increases the average rarity of items (stars only, not Swipp/etc.) by changing the probability distribution. You need a [i]lot[/i] of Quality to see a noticeable difference. Quality is based on the dragon with the highest stat for that Gathering type, and is only increased slightly for additional dragons. [*]There is only Gathering, no Swipp or Rare focus. [*]All dragons on the team gain XP in that Gathering type whenever they are sent to Gather. [*]Teams can be changed freely, potentially between every Gathering turn. [/LIST] This would ideally be paired with something that produced a consistent (if low) supply of food points for minimal effort- perhaps a Farming mechanic? [quote name="@DragonSage" date=2017-11-19 20:30:17] Tying the gathering system to individual dragons will penalize players who frequently change their lair. Increasing the number of gatherers based on the number of dragons or lair spaces penalizes players who choose to have small lairs. Gathering should remain an easy way to get food or items, and it shouldn't penalize players because they have different play styles. Your suggested system would penalize players with different play systems while the current system doesn't matter if your lair is large or small nor does it matter if you have long term residents or you frequently change your lair inhabitants. [/quote] I disagree strongly (though only because I enjoy an element of challenge in games). I feel that if playstyle doesn't matter then the game starts to get boring- choices you make should have upsides and downsides. The Familiars system penalizes those who choose to have small lairs (they need to do a lot more tedious familiar-swapping). The Coliseum heavily penalizes those who choose to cycle out their lairs. I do understand that some very basic system is needed for those who don't want to use the more engaging ones, though. (For example, you can currently get by on Gathering if the Coli doesn't interest you.) If Gathering became more demanding, there could be issues. My two ideas for that problem are 1) replacing Gathering with the idea I detailed above and adding a low-effort Farming, or 2) adding this as a way to get unique items alongside normal Gathering. (Both would need a bit of a nerf if this were the case.)

@WyvernVenom play style differences can come in effect in other aspects of the game. Gathering should remain the basic system for those with little time or inability to access other aspects of the game. Eventually they’ll add the adventure system and other features which will add more to the game.

Gathering is already a low effort system, to me it makes more sense to keep it the same easy system and just update it so that leveling up actually means something (such as increasing the minimum draw) rather than add more strategy to it and then create a new low effort system to replace gathering. Nor should gathering be nerfed just to add a gathering 2.0

An interesting farming system itself could be a way to allow differences in play style and game play as would a cooking feature.

It started with 'I have a question' but the more I thought about general idea the more I like it. So here we go:

1 & 2. I'm okay with the idea as long as gaining expirence would work like in coli with max of 3 slots. I mean it will be hard to adjust to make it work so you don't have to spend months on grinding one fodder to the highest level, that would make reselling prices really high.
So let's say your dragon reachers level 40 of fishing and it gets a little emblem next to the familar icon. That could eliminate some difficulties and satisfy people that want the leveling to matter.

3. Assuming that rare items start with 4-star rarity then there is from 5 to 12 types of items across gathering options in certain location. That could result in a lot of empt turns. As the turns are limited I'd rather get one two-point food than nothing.
I would prefer to see something like having an option to use your turn on different levels. If I look for Mute Swans in Ice I start at level 21 and get all rarity items from level 21 to the level I have achivet via expirence gaines. But 'Gathering Location' can be already considered an equivalent and it would still need more items most.
Giving up on the regional gathering could solve the problem, it could also make grinding gathering a little easier but I'm not sure how people would feel about taking away flight's items.

4 & 5.
I'm in favor of awarding effort - adding % chance/turns for players using their Gathering turns (additional chances based on gathering level maybe). It would basically work on the same basis as familiars do.
Against adding stats to dragons, it seems like a lot of additional work (coding) for a little outcome.

It also seems to go nicely with developer's philosophy (judging by as much as can be figured out from the mehcanics already in game) so it could be a good revamp and a fun feature to play.