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Make Flight Rising better by sharing your ideas!
TOPIC | Bring back egg rot!
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@Jacq

I like the idea, but instead of rotting, maybe reinstate them as "stolen". If the eggs sit for too long unattended, they are stolen by scavengers that would account for all the unhatched eggs and parentless dragons in the lore. That way the babies aren't really 'dying' so much as just being adopted by other clans.
@Jacq

I like the idea, but instead of rotting, maybe reinstate them as "stolen". If the eggs sit for too long unattended, they are stolen by scavengers that would account for all the unhatched eggs and parentless dragons in the lore. That way the babies aren't really 'dying' so much as just being adopted by other clans.
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[quote name="Jacq" date="2015-01-05 18:14:14"]Just to clarify, this was a feature of the site at launch that was removed in August 2013 because of site downtime beyond players' control. If you go to your account settings, you can see the remnants of it in the list as "Eggs Discarded". So it's not technically a feature added "after the fact", but a feature to possibly be reimplemented now that the site seems relatively stable (even during NoTN, the site was only unavailable for a few hours tops over a few days).[/quote] Was that really why they removed egg rot? [url=http://flightrising.tumblr.com/post/58774860395/nest-mechanic-change]This[/url] is the only official source I could find and it doesn't say anything about downtime. It's been a while, but I'm pretty sure it was removed due to suggestion threads. Downtime was a bit of a relief, incubation wise, because Akiri autoincubated everyone's eggs. Nobody's eggs would rot... and there would be a great bonanza of freshly hatched nests if the site was down for long enough.
Jacq wrote on 2015-01-05 18:14:14:
Just to clarify, this was a feature of the site at launch that was removed in August 2013 because of site downtime beyond players' control. If you go to your account settings, you can see the remnants of it in the list as "Eggs Discarded". So it's not technically a feature added "after the fact", but a feature to possibly be reimplemented now that the site seems relatively stable (even during NoTN, the site was only unavailable for a few hours tops over a few days).
Was that really why they removed egg rot? This is the only official source I could find and it doesn't say anything about downtime. It's been a while, but I'm pretty sure it was removed due to suggestion threads. Downtime was a bit of a relief, incubation wise, because Akiri autoincubated everyone's eggs. Nobody's eggs would rot... and there would be a great bonanza of freshly hatched nests if the site was down for long enough.
“blaireau’s
@Melodist
That's a great idea, and it would still fit with the "Eggs lost" listing. Lore-wise, it would also explain the unhatched eggs found while scavenging or in the coli - dropped by an egg thief!

@blaireau
1. Yes, this is listed in the OP as a possible problem/detriment :/

2. Being able to access the internet once a week (as outlined) would mean each nest would have about a 30% chance to lose one egg. I'm not sure how that would make breeding "impossible"? The chances of losing an entire nest over the 5 incubation periods, assuming a person only incubates once a week, is still fairly small (though, granted, a real possibility, especially if the nest is only 1 or 2 eggs). I'm not sure I'd say it would make breeding impossible, though. But, again, I have to ask if there are users who regularly visit the site once a week really breeding that many dragons that losing an egg here and there would be a regular issue? How are they feeding them if that's the case?

3. I would argue that the "hunger" mechanic has no positive reward, and exists solely as a negative encouragement to visit the site daily (for gathering food). Were it meant to be positive or neutral, I don't think there would be real punishments for hungry dragons (ie - not being able to breed or enter the coli with low energy).

Sorry if the sitting on the nest thing comes across as overly harsh. I can't think of a better way to explain the way the "intention" of the really expensive lair expansions comes across. Halting the rot mechanic after a nest is ready to hatch is also already in the OP as a possible compromise.
@Melodist
That's a great idea, and it would still fit with the "Eggs lost" listing. Lore-wise, it would also explain the unhatched eggs found while scavenging or in the coli - dropped by an egg thief!

@blaireau
1. Yes, this is listed in the OP as a possible problem/detriment :/

2. Being able to access the internet once a week (as outlined) would mean each nest would have about a 30% chance to lose one egg. I'm not sure how that would make breeding "impossible"? The chances of losing an entire nest over the 5 incubation periods, assuming a person only incubates once a week, is still fairly small (though, granted, a real possibility, especially if the nest is only 1 or 2 eggs). I'm not sure I'd say it would make breeding impossible, though. But, again, I have to ask if there are users who regularly visit the site once a week really breeding that many dragons that losing an egg here and there would be a regular issue? How are they feeding them if that's the case?

3. I would argue that the "hunger" mechanic has no positive reward, and exists solely as a negative encouragement to visit the site daily (for gathering food). Were it meant to be positive or neutral, I don't think there would be real punishments for hungry dragons (ie - not being able to breed or enter the coli with low energy).

Sorry if the sitting on the nest thing comes across as overly harsh. I can't think of a better way to explain the way the "intention" of the really expensive lair expansions comes across. Halting the rot mechanic after a nest is ready to hatch is also already in the OP as a possible compromise.
2. I was mostly referring to the way egg rot used to work. The mechanic you are proposing is more lenient, but I still think it's a royal pain. I'd have a 32% chance to lose one egg per week, more if I missed a week. Over the course of 5-6 weeks, that adds up. I could easily lose the entire nest.

3. Except if I quit for a month, I can still feed all of my dragons the minute I get back. (I have a large stockpile of food + I coli grind + the AH is always an option.) There is no mechanic for recovering rotten eggs.
2. I was mostly referring to the way egg rot used to work. The mechanic you are proposing is more lenient, but I still think it's a royal pain. I'd have a 32% chance to lose one egg per week, more if I missed a week. Over the course of 5-6 weeks, that adds up. I could easily lose the entire nest.

3. Except if I quit for a month, I can still feed all of my dragons the minute I get back. (I have a large stockpile of food + I coli grind + the AH is always an option.) There is no mechanic for recovering rotten eggs.
“blaireau’s
@Jacq: Okay, if you want egg rot, my friend has a brilliant solution: impose a rule on yourself where if you miss an incubation, one hatching from that nest must be immediately exalted.

Problem solved.
@Jacq: Okay, if you want egg rot, my friend has a brilliant solution: impose a rule on yourself where if you miss an incubation, one hatching from that nest must be immediately exalted.

Problem solved.
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@blaireau
2. Yes, I think it would be a bit of a pain, but I'm not sure it's really as negative as all that.

3. If someone regularly only visits the site once a week, I'm not sure they would regularly have the resources to stockpile that much food. I mean, yes, it's possible. I'm just saying I think the percentage of the userbase that fits into the category of "would lose loads of eggs" and "only visits the site once a week for weeks at a time while breeding" is really small. How much consideration should the outlying cases be given?

Ultimately, it's not meant to be a reward but something that enriches the site, increases engagement and (yes) increases the difficulty. There are situations where it sucks. But coming back from an unexpected absense to a lair full of starving dragons also sucks. Nobody's suggesting we remove the hunger mechanic because of those outlying cases.

@TaffertianTales
It's fine to not like the suggestion, but you don't have to get grouchy at me specifically just because you don't like it. :/
(And you didn't answer my question. . .)
@blaireau
2. Yes, I think it would be a bit of a pain, but I'm not sure it's really as negative as all that.

3. If someone regularly only visits the site once a week, I'm not sure they would regularly have the resources to stockpile that much food. I mean, yes, it's possible. I'm just saying I think the percentage of the userbase that fits into the category of "would lose loads of eggs" and "only visits the site once a week for weeks at a time while breeding" is really small. How much consideration should the outlying cases be given?

Ultimately, it's not meant to be a reward but something that enriches the site, increases engagement and (yes) increases the difficulty. There are situations where it sucks. But coming back from an unexpected absense to a lair full of starving dragons also sucks. Nobody's suggesting we remove the hunger mechanic because of those outlying cases.

@TaffertianTales
It's fine to not like the suggestion, but you don't have to get grouchy at me specifically just because you don't like it. :/
(And you didn't answer my question. . .)
@Jacq: No, I was being serious. It let's you have your egg rot and everyone else have their casual game. There are Pokemon fans who made the Nuzlocke Challenge for the same reason.
(I thought others answered it already?)

Edit: friend says hungry dragons don't die though. Not the same thing.
@Jacq: No, I was being serious. It let's you have your egg rot and everyone else have their casual game. There are Pokemon fans who made the Nuzlocke Challenge for the same reason.
(I thought others answered it already?)

Edit: friend says hungry dragons don't die though. Not the same thing.
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I like this idea, however it is implemented
I like this idea, however it is implemented
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@Jacq You asked for clarification at one point, so here's an extra two cents from me, as someone that can't always log in.

For me, part of the issue is the added inconvenience. Yes, it wouldn't be terrible to lose an egg or two, but on the flip side, would it be so bad to not have the decay? (Given that there are ways to discard unwanted dragons, but no ways to bring them back. Though if there were an item to un-rot the eggs before hatching, that could be an interesting balance...)

Because of my health, I've had to give up on a lot of seemingly casual games because they had timer mechanics I just couldn't keep up with. Pets could starve or die, would never hatch, run away, etc. Some needed an hourly or daily checkup, others required enough clicks to play with or feed said pet. For a while I thought about abandoning FR because of egg rot, since it was too stressful trying to make sure I logged in to click the right buttons when health issues struck. (Okay, the lag back then didn't help *grins*)

Sure, it's only one nest/breeding try, but sometimes those nests were arranged with other people, had long timers to try again, were for long-term projects...it was annoying, and it discouraged me from future breeding. When I'm out sick for a week or more, the last thing I want to worry about is having a nest I'm splitting with a friend rot away because I can't log in. (Or worse, a stranger that paid for the breeding)

I like your timer idea better than the old egg rot system, but at the same time I'd hate to have to start worrying about keeping track of the timing again. (I didn't notice it in the OP, but it's late here, so I could have missed it...how would the timer scale for smaller nests? If you only have the one egg on a wildclaw pair, I'd hate to see that rot so soon, where a four egg nest has the extra time. If I just missed it, and it balances out, that helps)

Again, if this had an opt out option I'd be fine supporting it. The idea of egg rot (or having them stolen...that sounds a bit more interesting) is neat...it's just not something I personally want to worry about dealing with.
@Jacq You asked for clarification at one point, so here's an extra two cents from me, as someone that can't always log in.

For me, part of the issue is the added inconvenience. Yes, it wouldn't be terrible to lose an egg or two, but on the flip side, would it be so bad to not have the decay? (Given that there are ways to discard unwanted dragons, but no ways to bring them back. Though if there were an item to un-rot the eggs before hatching, that could be an interesting balance...)

Because of my health, I've had to give up on a lot of seemingly casual games because they had timer mechanics I just couldn't keep up with. Pets could starve or die, would never hatch, run away, etc. Some needed an hourly or daily checkup, others required enough clicks to play with or feed said pet. For a while I thought about abandoning FR because of egg rot, since it was too stressful trying to make sure I logged in to click the right buttons when health issues struck. (Okay, the lag back then didn't help *grins*)

Sure, it's only one nest/breeding try, but sometimes those nests were arranged with other people, had long timers to try again, were for long-term projects...it was annoying, and it discouraged me from future breeding. When I'm out sick for a week or more, the last thing I want to worry about is having a nest I'm splitting with a friend rot away because I can't log in. (Or worse, a stranger that paid for the breeding)

I like your timer idea better than the old egg rot system, but at the same time I'd hate to have to start worrying about keeping track of the timing again. (I didn't notice it in the OP, but it's late here, so I could have missed it...how would the timer scale for smaller nests? If you only have the one egg on a wildclaw pair, I'd hate to see that rot so soon, where a four egg nest has the extra time. If I just missed it, and it balances out, that helps)

Again, if this had an opt out option I'd be fine supporting it. The idea of egg rot (or having them stolen...that sounds a bit more interesting) is neat...it's just not something I personally want to worry about dealing with.
@Tharah Thanks for your feedback. I didn't think of how it would scale for smaller nests, but that does seem to be a good idea. Maybe something like the rotonly affects the "fifth" egg in a cycle, then the fourth, and so on... technically giving someone closer to a month per incubation. I will add something to OP suggesting that, and also the Opt-in that others have mentioned. [i]edit[/i]: this is what I added: [quote]Have the counter only effect the "5th" egg in a nest, don't start the counter for the "4th" egg until the "5th" egg has rotted. Effectively, not incubating for 10 days means you lose the 5th egg, but the 1st egg (the only egg in a one-egg nest) wouldn't rot until almost 1.5-2 months have passed without the user logging in.[/quote] It's interesting to hear the insight from people that were around during the time Egg Rot was actually implemented, and the issues and stress it caused - as well as from those who liked it (or at least weren't bothered). From my end, the site seems to be missing a feature (rotting is still mentioned in the nesting FAQ, "eggs lost" is listed in my profile, etc), and most all of the information I found regarding it implied the stress was caused more my serverside issues (ie lag, downtime) rather than user frustration.
@Tharah
Thanks for your feedback. I didn't think of how it would scale for smaller nests, but that does seem to be a good idea. Maybe something like the rotonly affects the "fifth" egg in a cycle, then the fourth, and so on... technically giving someone closer to a month per incubation. I will add something to OP suggesting that, and also the Opt-in that others have mentioned.
edit: this is what I added:
Quote:
Have the counter only effect the "5th" egg in a nest, don't start the counter for the "4th" egg until the "5th" egg has rotted. Effectively, not incubating for 10 days means you lose the 5th egg, but the 1st egg (the only egg in a one-egg nest) wouldn't rot until almost 1.5-2 months have passed without the user logging in.

It's interesting to hear the insight from people that were around during the time Egg Rot was actually implemented, and the issues and stress it caused - as well as from those who liked it (or at least weren't bothered). From my end, the site seems to be missing a feature (rotting is still mentioned in the nesting FAQ, "eggs lost" is listed in my profile, etc), and most all of the information I found regarding it implied the stress was caused more my serverside issues (ie lag, downtime) rather than user frustration.
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