[quote name="Zaltys" date="2013-07-02 08:47:10" url="main.php?p=mb&board=frd&page=2&id=246910#252177"]So if the exalting reward gets raised, I think that the coliseum loot needs to be nerfed to keep things balanced. [/quote]
I have to disagree with this completely. It would be unfair to nerf the coliseum loot simply because exalting gains a better bonus. The sole source of income for some people is the coliseum, and ONLY the coliseum. Some of those people could also very well never intend to exalt any dragons, ever. They'd be completely SOL if something like that were to happen.
So if the exalting reward gets raised, I think that the coliseum loot needs to be nerfed to keep things balanced.
I have to disagree with this completely. It would be unfair to nerf the coliseum loot simply because exalting gains a better bonus. The sole source of income for some people is the coliseum, and ONLY the coliseum. Some of those people could also very well never intend to exalt any dragons, ever. They'd be completely SOL if something like that were to happen.
It's great to read this and learn about the exalting system, then also see a mod's input. Great info!
It's great to read this and learn about the exalting system, then also see a mod's input. Great info!
Don't get me wrong, we DO need a way to delete dragons like we do now. Otherwise people would be stuck with a dragon they can't seem to sell or get rid of in order to make space in a lair.
I do support the ability to delete (exalt) your own owned or bred dragons. I support the idea of having trained dragons pay out more. (effort vs. reward and all that) I just don't agree with making it profitable and a desirable thing to do in so much as people will actively buy perfectly good breeding dragons in order to delete them for a reward.
By increasing the payout for trained dragons, that would mean less dragons deleted this way.
Don't get me wrong, we DO need a way to delete dragons like we do now. Otherwise people would be stuck with a dragon they can't seem to sell or get rid of in order to make space in a lair.
I do support the ability to delete (exalt) your own owned or bred dragons. I support the idea of having trained dragons pay out more. (effort vs. reward and all that) I just don't agree with making it profitable and a desirable thing to do in so much as people will actively buy perfectly good breeding dragons in order to delete them for a reward.
By increasing the payout for trained dragons, that would mean less dragons deleted this way.
[quote name="Peixes" date="2013-07-01 22:56:41" url="main.php?p=mb&board=frd&page=1&id=246910#247143"]@Xhaztol I think the thing that gets me, reading this, assuming those numbers are correct is this:
[b]
A level 1 dragon gets on average 1500T per level.
A level 25 dragon gets on average 480T per level.
[/b]
I imagine that's not QUITE how the system computes it, but kind of a moot point when that's the end result. Leveling in the coliseum is a serious time investment though, at the very least, and it just seems to me like there's no drive to exalt leveled dragons when doing so means you actually get less of an average return. The auction house market prices don't really matter at that point. [/quote]
Wow... I hadn't seen this post before but just wow... the dragon is actually worth LESS per level when it gets to that point and way more work was put into it. It must take a week or two of consistent playing to get there. I hope they at least make it the SAME price per level rather than 2/3rds less!
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Xhaztol I think the thing that gets me, reading this, assuming those numbers are correct is this:
A level 1 dragon gets on average 1500T per level.
A level 25 dragon gets on average 480T per level.
I imagine that's not QUITE how the system computes it, but kind of a moot point when that's the end result. Leveling in the coliseum is a serious time investment though, at the very least, and it just seems to me like there's no drive to exalt leveled dragons when doing so means you actually get less of an average return. The auction house market prices don't really matter at that point.
Wow... I hadn't seen this post before but just wow... the dragon is actually worth LESS per level when it gets to that point and way more work was put into it. It must take a week or two of consistent playing to get there. I hope they at least make it the SAME price per level rather than 2/3rds less!
I am forever against getting rid of Coliseum loot. Thrage himself said Fairgrounds is for getting Treasure, and the Coliseum is for getting swag (stuff).
If the loot was taken out of the Coliseum I would have 0 desire to play it, and it would take roughly 50% of the playability away from the website for me and other players who enjoy fighting and getting rewards. I don't want to train my dragons to exalt them. I train them because it's fun interaction with my favorite 3 dragons. I get rewarded for my patience and consistently and the rewards are few and far between. This is how I get my food so I can use my gathering turns on digging for Treasure.
I sincerely hope that they to not remove Coliseum drops. Based on what Thrage has said in the past I don't think they're going to... so that's good. <3
I am forever against getting rid of Coliseum loot. Thrage himself said Fairgrounds is for getting Treasure, and the Coliseum is for getting swag (stuff).
If the loot was taken out of the Coliseum I would have 0 desire to play it, and it would take roughly 50% of the playability away from the website for me and other players who enjoy fighting and getting rewards. I don't want to train my dragons to exalt them. I train them because it's fun interaction with my favorite 3 dragons. I get rewarded for my patience and consistently and the rewards are few and far between. This is how I get my food so I can use my gathering turns on digging for Treasure.
I sincerely hope that they to not remove Coliseum drops. Based on what Thrage has said in the past I don't think they're going to... so that's good. <3
@
DragnEnchantres
Oh yeah, I understand the point of exalting is a means of keeping the dragon population in control. I realize we need that.
It's just frustrating to see an exalted dragon when I search and have to think... "I would have brought you..." *shakes fist in the air*
@
DragnEnchantres
Oh yeah, I understand the point of exalting is a means of keeping the dragon population in control. I realize we need that.
It's just frustrating to see an exalted dragon when I search and have to think... "I would have brought you..." *shakes fist in the air*
I am perfectly fine with the way things are right now in regards to exalting and the dominance rewards. I have not exalted anyone yet, but when my breeding finally picks up I will probably be exalting a few hatchlings every week to make space. I have played Wajas and Felisfire, sites that have problems with population control; the devs here on FR did an excellent job implementing a system for population control right from the start, and it's a good system.
However, I think that the Coliseum loot should be adjusted slightly to make it a little bit more lucrative and to encourage people to level their dragons. I am extremely against removing loot because the economy is so derped right now - there are more ways for treasure to be removed from the system than there is for it to come in, which is I think is partially why dragons cost so much in the first place.
Exalting a high level dragon should not be a loss or a disappointment, and it should be able to pay for the time and money it took to get it to level 25 through loot in the Coliseum. I should not have to rely on "a few lucky" drops as I level my dragon, because that money is earned once and inconsistently. There is nothing so rare that can be dropped right now that selling it would be truly worth it.
That 12k earned from exalting a level 25? That should be profit, a small reward, not something to cover costs. That dragon should have went above and beyond paying for itself in the Coliseum.
I am perfectly fine with the way things are right now in regards to exalting and the dominance rewards. I have not exalted anyone yet, but when my breeding finally picks up I will probably be exalting a few hatchlings every week to make space. I have played Wajas and Felisfire, sites that have problems with population control; the devs here on FR did an excellent job implementing a system for population control right from the start, and it's a good system.
However, I think that the Coliseum loot should be adjusted slightly to make it a little bit more lucrative and to encourage people to level their dragons. I am extremely against removing loot because the economy is so derped right now - there are more ways for treasure to be removed from the system than there is for it to come in, which is I think is partially why dragons cost so much in the first place.
Exalting a high level dragon should not be a loss or a disappointment, and it should be able to pay for the time and money it took to get it to level 25 through loot in the Coliseum. I should not have to rely on "a few lucky" drops as I level my dragon, because that money is earned once and inconsistently. There is nothing so rare that can be dropped right now that selling it would be truly worth it.
That 12k earned from exalting a level 25? That should be profit, a small reward, not something to cover costs. That dragon should have went above and beyond paying for itself in the Coliseum.
I absolutely agree with Dragoness here, I wouldn't like to see that the Coliseum loot is decreased or removed, just to increase the treasure you get from exalted dragons.
While I'm building up the fundament of my clan right now and with the high market prices for hatchlings, exalting isn't really important for me at the moment but I'm pretty sure later it will be very important.
I wasn't able to find the post again, but someone said hatchling prices at the market were less than 1000 treasure in the beta after a few months. So I can really imagine that exalting could become a lucrative way to "sell" your dragons.
However, I do agree that the treasure you get should be increases a little. 12000 seems to be indeed a bit too low. Maybe, 1000 per level would be a nice option, so level 25 = 25000 treasure. I'm aware that it isn't very much as well but then again exalting was not purely made to earn yourself treasure, at least if I understood this feature correctly ;)
Apart from that, @
TechyConversant, I'm really sorry this happened to you, I'd probably be irritated and a bit upset as well. Honestly I imagined to get at least 50000 treasure for a level 25, and I'm kinda glad I didn't give the exalt button a try so far. ^^;
I absolutely agree with Dragoness here, I wouldn't like to see that the Coliseum loot is decreased or removed, just to increase the treasure you get from exalted dragons.
While I'm building up the fundament of my clan right now and with the high market prices for hatchlings, exalting isn't really important for me at the moment but I'm pretty sure later it will be very important.
I wasn't able to find the post again, but someone said hatchling prices at the market were less than 1000 treasure in the beta after a few months. So I can really imagine that exalting could become a lucrative way to "sell" your dragons.
However, I do agree that the treasure you get should be increases a little. 12000 seems to be indeed a bit too low. Maybe, 1000 per level would be a nice option, so level 25 = 25000 treasure. I'm aware that it isn't very much as well but then again exalting was not purely made to earn yourself treasure, at least if I understood this feature correctly ;)
Apart from that, @
TechyConversant, I'm really sorry this happened to you, I'd probably be irritated and a bit upset as well. Honestly I imagined to get at least 50000 treasure for a level 25, and I'm kinda glad I didn't give the exalt button a try so far. ^^;
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H I D D E N • S A N C T U M
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and I have circled for thousands of years ..."
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To me, logically, a minimum of 25K for a lv25 dragon would be a good compromise; at this current point in time that doesn't seem like much, but keeping a fixed 1K (or more) per level would create a sensible 'profit barometer' in the long run, and would encourage players to level their dragons, participate in what the site has to offer, and overall contribute to the health of the community. Then, after they've done what they set out to do with that dragon, they can comfortably exalt them in order to make room for the next generation...with which to do it all again!
As it stands, it's more profitable to exalt a lv1 hatchling than a lv25, tricked-out adult dragon, which...really doesn't make sense, even just from a meta perspective. You're telling me the Arcanist wants MORE dumb kids around than rational adults? I don't buy it.
Six months from now, with more people breeding and selling, prices are expected to drop on 'rarer' breeds, which is why I think a fixed rate per level for Exalting makes the most sense. 25K-50K may not seem like much in terms of returns now, but that might change, rapidly.
Also: I definitely don't think exalting should become a way to MAKE treasure, but there needs to be more incentive to use it, otherwise there's asking for trouble. That said, there are currently more ways to get treasure OUT of the economy than IN it, which is already a problem. Just my 2c!
Disclaimer: this may not make sense/be a rehash of what others have said, etc. It's late.
To me, logically, a minimum of 25K for a lv25 dragon would be a good compromise; at this current point in time that doesn't seem like much, but keeping a fixed 1K (or more) per level would create a sensible 'profit barometer' in the long run, and would encourage players to level their dragons, participate in what the site has to offer, and overall contribute to the health of the community. Then, after they've done what they set out to do with that dragon, they can comfortably exalt them in order to make room for the next generation...with which to do it all again!
As it stands, it's more profitable to exalt a lv1 hatchling than a lv25, tricked-out adult dragon, which...really doesn't make sense, even just from a meta perspective. You're telling me the Arcanist wants MORE dumb kids around than rational adults? I don't buy it.
Six months from now, with more people breeding and selling, prices are expected to drop on 'rarer' breeds, which is why I think a fixed rate per level for Exalting makes the most sense. 25K-50K may not seem like much in terms of returns now, but that might change, rapidly.
Also: I definitely don't think exalting should become a way to MAKE treasure, but there needs to be more incentive to use it, otherwise there's asking for trouble. That said, there are currently more ways to get treasure OUT of the economy than IN it, which is already a problem. Just my 2c!
Disclaimer: this may not make sense/be a rehash of what others have said, etc. It's late.
