Flight Rising Discussion

Vials already giving off that "too valuable to use" syndrome going on, and I don't breed anything but fodder. Staff, seriously, bring the vials back from retirement. Anyone who ever wants anything but common on their progens get a really short stick in all this, especially newbies in the future, oh gosh.
This site is so much about customization, till now?
Even you admit, it's not a breeding sim, this should not be the most important element here.

[quote name="micahjaguar" date="2018-06-13 18:02:07" ] I think the idea of having new eyes is cool, and as a mechanic it scores high on the 'game-changing and thus appropriate for a five year anniversary' metric. Really good brainstorming. I find it interesting to hatch eggs again, and curious to see what future eye enhancements you're planning. *hat-tip* Your celebratory implementation was bizarre, however, and your communications afterwards, baffling. I feel as if you have no PR or marketing people on your staff who understand how to interact with and manage customer relations. (Maybe you don't? I can recommend some books on the topic.) The moment the userbase started responding to your Big Huge Celebratory Announcements with an explosion of pain points, you should have immediately made a post that said: "We have overlooked some gameplay styles that are negatively impacted by our decision. We want this event to be exciting for all our players, and we'd like to hear how we can address your concerns. Please post to this official thread, and tell us how we could do this better.' After reading--and managing--that thread, you would have had enough data to make decisions, and without causing the mass hysteria and anger that resulted because of your silence. Communication is key when you've upset your customers. It's the only thing. And having collected all this data in a less emotionally charged manner by heading off your userbase's upset before it could build, I think you would probably have made different decisions. As it is, you present the image of having been backed into a corner, and politely showing your teeth and warning everyone from trying for you. Probably because you feel that way. Y'all, FR is your income and your job, and we're your customers. You consistently don't handle your customers well. I don't mean *user* management--I'm not talking about 'how do I keep my users from trespassing on the site rules and making abusive forum threads.' I mean *customer* management, where you understand how to interact with people who pay you in a way that makes them happy to pay you, and more willing to keep paying you in the future. Right now, you often give the impression that we're impositions on your vision, and that if you could have the site not have any people while making your money, you would probably prefer that. :/ tl;dr: You really need to research marketing and learn how to communicate with your customers. Your tone deafness in this arena is costing you money. [/quote] I completely agree. There is so much that isn't being addressed and so much just wasn't done right when the problem first started that it really feels like the ability to communicate is something this site lacks. Even if some things are going to be corrected or changed from this update, like the messed up multi-gaze, it would be nice for something to be posted ahead of time letting us know than the fix being implemented and then having it addressed. Waiting until the problems are fixed to even address them leaves people feeling like they were ignored for way longer than they should. Unfortunately I feel like nothing else will be done to address the issues of this update which is overall rather sad. This could have been something really fun. Now it just feels like a hot mess.

[quote name="micahjaguar" date="2018-06-13 18:02:07" ] I think the idea of having new eyes is cool, and as a mechanic it scores high on the 'game-changing and thus appropriate for a five year anniversary' metric. Really good brainstorming. I find it interesting to hatch eggs again, and curious to see what future eye enhancements you're planning. *hat-tip* Your celebratory implementation was bizarre, however, and your communications afterwards, baffling. I feel as if you have no PR or marketing people on your staff who understand how to interact with and manage customer relations. (Maybe you don't? I can recommend some books on the topic.) The moment the userbase started responding to your Big Huge Celebratory Announcements with an explosion of pain points, you should have immediately made a post that said: "We have overlooked some gameplay styles that are negatively impacted by our decision. We want this event to be exciting for all our players, and we'd like to hear how we can address your concerns. Please post to this official thread, and tell us how we could do this better.' After reading--and managing--that thread, you would have had enough data to make decisions, and without causing the mass hysteria and anger that resulted because of your silence. Communication is key when you've upset your customers. It's the only thing. And having collected all this data in a less emotionally charged manner by heading off your userbase's upset before it could build, I think you would probably have made different decisions. As it is, you present the image of having been backed into a corner, and politely showing your teeth and warning everyone from trying for you. Probably because you feel that way. Y'all, FR is your income and your job, and we're your customers. You consistently don't handle your customers well. I don't mean *user* management--I'm not talking about 'how do I keep my users from trespassing on the site rules and making abusive forum threads.' I mean *customer* management, where you understand how to interact with people who pay you in a way that makes them happy to pay you, and more willing to keep paying you in the future. [b]Right now, you often give the impression that we're impositions on your vision, and that if you could have the site not have any people while making your money, you would probably prefer that. :/[/b] tl;dr: You really need to research marketing and learn how to communicate with your customers. Your tone deafness in this arena is costing you money. [/quote] This is the most beautifully and respectfully stated summary of the situation's escalation I have seen. I seriously implore the staff to read and re-read this, to commit it to memory. Especially the section that I've bolded. It seems like they don't quite care about how we feel as a community to give our dragons the eyes they've introduced and tantalized us with because it isn't what [i]they[/i] decided. To brush off your fan base's opinions of this kind of game for your own "vision" is dangerous and hurtful to both parties.

I can't believe I read through all 138 pages of this thread.

This may get deleted again, but dang it does anyone really think things are going to change this way?? By yelling loudly enough that we get what we want? We have a good number of people explaining what went wrong, and serious problems that need to and should be addressed - but it's being drowned out in players that are just upset that they didn't get the ultra rare eye on the dragon they wanted it on.

I feel like the scattersight vials did what they intended. They gave old dragons the same chance as a hatchling would to get that eye type.

The vials weren't a guaranteed primal, and were never advertised as a guaranteed primal.

I've worked retail for 8 soul sucking years and right now being on FR is like being behind that register getting blamed because someone's expired coupon didn't work.

Things that need to be addressed/fixed IMO

- People SHOULD be refunded. (Tricky because people will try and abuse this for ~free money~ but the odds on the vials /were/ low, and the eyes /were/ misadvertised on the front page. Even if customers were not using the item as intended, the fact that it was misadvertised means that they are owed their money back. The biggest group affected is those that spends real money on a misadvertised feature.) Note: I personally have never bought gems- so this is not coming from a place of bias.

- Graphics SHOULD be fixed. The artifacting on Multi as well as the pupil opacity errors on some of the common eyes. I don't think a legacy eye option is the way but scelaras are more a design choice than consistency. Keep the color changes, bring back the design elements.

- Accessibility Issues. If people are having this bad of a reaction to something that is going to be a random appearance on the site, devs need to consider having toggles in some way. I know it's not the easiest thing to implement, but it /is/ something that should be discussed.



Things that IMO should not change

- Keep vials retired. Chances were low, the rates are crappy, and it's better that they die out. Really. I think we are misreading the Devs statements of "the vials are never returning" as "We will never get Primal on the dragon I want it on". That may not be the case. As long as this eye type is brought back through a different method (I liked the Baldwin fest/colosseum fest drop mentioned above) then they can keep their word while appeasing people. Joxar anyone??

BUT.

- These eye types should NOT be easily accessible I'm gonna lose my fruit loops if after all the work that's been put into adding a feature to the game that FOR ONCE doesn't cater to players who can throw gems out a window - becomes a pay to win feature again. No gem marketplace. This game NEEDS something to shake up the way we play. I can get behind rare coli drops and rare swips and high level fest only brews. But please keep this addition /interesting/. I don't NEED a 4th gene. I don't want to see Primal Hatcheries. The coli genes and baldwin genes were a GREAT start to this.

I adore this breeding RNG addition too! Besides the super rare eye types, this isn't going to affect breeding plans, and can enhance others! And with the addition of the Common Sight vial - it's reversible if you hatch a dragon but like the common eye better. We can still endlessly customize, but maybe it's time that not /every/ customization option can be bought.

I, and many others, like to challenge ourselves in our dragon collecting, breeding, and training. Eye Types in general have been stated to become accessible to both new dragons and old, through many methods. Maybe not the type you want, right NOW, but... how to put this nicely - A Game Easily Won Is Not Worth Playing Twice.

Those are my thoughts on the matter.

.... Actually, thinking upon it, it makes little sense to say bringing back vials (permanently) is unfair to new players. If anything, it makes it all the more fair because everyone has access to the vials, just as everyone has access to breeding. Players won’t have to pay ridiculous amounts just to roll uncommon, and even if they’re (preferably) harder to get, they’re there and not finite.

Aside from that thought, I really do think some accessibility measures need to be put in place (as this is what I was gonna comment on before my prior thought.) Though I am not one, there are people on this site who can no longer participate in the game without fear. That is a BIG problem- everything else on the site is avoidable to some degree. You don’t have to breed certain dragons or genes, you don’t have to live in a certain flight lair, you don’t have to visit lairs in flights that make you uncomfortable. You don’t have to collect certain familiars, use the coli, visit the forums. You can omit certain dragon traits from your searches in the auction house.

However, you can’t change the fact that your dragons could, at any point, hatch something that makes you physically sick. There’s no opt-in or opt-out, and for some, having to see that multi-eyes, facet, or primal dragon when first hatching isn’t gonna be fixed by being able to change it away with a common-eyes vial. It would be a too-little too-late deal.

Perhaps, as suggested quite a bit in this forum, there could be a toggle? I can’t speak for the difficulty of implementing such a thing, but maybe you could have it so those who toggle certain eyes off view them as the normal common eyes while they still have the eyes they should? That way, people could read the sidebar, see the hatch has eyes they can’t look at, and change or otherwise get rid of the dragon without worrying about getting sick. You toggled off and provided an opt-out to effects in the coli that made people sick, as well as offered an alternate shock switch once, so I think it’d be kind of you to provide something like this as well!

(Thank you for readin, apologies for wall of text and any errors)

Long as you leave out the body horror in future!!!

[quote name="DragonTamer" date="2018-06-13 22:57:08" ] [quote name="micahjaguar" date="2018-06-13 18:02:07" ] I think the idea of having new eyes is cool, and as a mechanic it scores high on the 'game-changing and thus appropriate for a five year anniversary' metric. Really good brainstorming. I find it interesting to hatch eggs again, and curious to see what future eye enhancements you're planning. *hat-tip* Your celebratory implementation was bizarre, however, and your communications afterwards, baffling. I feel as if you have no PR or marketing people on your staff who understand how to interact with and manage customer relations. (Maybe you don't? I can recommend some books on the topic.) The moment the userbase started responding to your Big Huge Celebratory Announcements with an explosion of pain points, you should have immediately made a post that said: "We have overlooked some gameplay styles that are negatively impacted by our decision. We want this event to be exciting for all our players, and we'd like to hear how we can address your concerns. Please post to this official thread, and tell us how we could do this better.' After reading--and managing--that thread, you would have had enough data to make decisions, and without causing the mass hysteria and anger that resulted because of your silence. Communication is key when you've upset your customers. It's the only thing. And having collected all this data in a less emotionally charged manner by heading off your userbase's upset before it could build, I think you would probably have made different decisions. As it is, you present the image of having been backed into a corner, and politely showing your teeth and warning everyone from trying for you. Probably because you feel that way. Y'all, FR is your income and your job, and we're your customers. You consistently don't handle your customers well. I don't mean *user* management--I'm not talking about 'how do I keep my users from trespassing on the site rules and making abusive forum threads.' I mean *customer* management, where you understand how to interact with people who pay you in a way that makes them happy to pay you, and more willing to keep paying you in the future. [b]Right now, you often give the impression that we're impositions on your vision, and that if you could have the site not have any people while making your money, you would probably prefer that. :/[/b] tl;dr: You really need to research marketing and learn how to communicate with your customers. Your tone deafness in this arena is costing you money. [/quote] This is the most beautifully and respectfully stated summary of the situation's escalation I have seen. I seriously implore the staff to read and re-read this, to commit it to memory. Especially the section that I've bolded. It seems like they don't quite care about how we feel as a community to give our dragons the eyes they've introduced and tantalized us with because it isn't what [i]they[/i] decided. To brush off your fan base's opinions of this kind of game for your own "vision" is dangerous and hurtful to both parties. [/quote] At the same time, I mostly agree with this as well... although I think there is a way for FR to improve their PR and reaching middle ground with "customers" while also keeping to their vision and not bending to every whim we have on how we /think/ the site should be run. I said this before, right before the main thread closed. But I am firmly opposed to the team making promises to us so early. Right now we are giving them SO MUCH pressure to change things and change them NOW. Without giving them time to compile data, to discuss what is best for the site [i]and[/i] it's users, and to implement it in a well coded, strong, and beneficial way. They messed up with the initial introduction, but beyond starting to give refunds for gems spent on the anniversary, I have no issue whatsoever giving them time to discuss the best method of moving forward from here. I want communication right now - NOT action.

[quote name="micahjaguar" date="2018-06-13 18:02:07" ] I think the idea of having new eyes is cool, and as a mechanic it scores high on the 'game-changing and thus appropriate for a five year anniversary' metric. Really good brainstorming. I find it interesting to hatch eggs again, and curious to see what future eye enhancements you're planning. *hat-tip* Your celebratory implementation was bizarre, however, and your communications afterwards, baffling. I feel as if you have no PR or marketing people on your staff who understand how to interact with and manage customer relations. (Maybe you don't? I can recommend some books on the topic.) The moment the userbase started responding to your Big Huge Celebratory Announcements with an explosion of pain points, you should have immediately made a post that said: "We have overlooked some gameplay styles that are negatively impacted by our decision. We want this event to be exciting for all our players, and we'd like to hear how we can address your concerns. Please post to this official thread, and tell us how we could do this better.' After reading--and managing--that thread, you would have had enough data to make decisions, and without causing the mass hysteria and anger that resulted because of your silence. Communication is key when you've upset your customers. It's the only thing. And having collected all this data in a less emotionally charged manner by heading off your userbase's upset before it could build, I think you would probably have made different decisions. As it is, you present the image of having been backed into a corner, and politely showing your teeth and warning everyone from trying for you. Probably because you feel that way. Y'all, FR is your income and your job, and we're your customers. You consistently don't handle your customers well. I don't mean *user* management--I'm not talking about 'how do I keep my users from trespassing on the site rules and making abusive forum threads.' I mean *customer* management, where you understand how to interact with people who pay you in a way that makes them happy to pay you, and more willing to keep paying you in the future. Right now, you often give the impression that we're impositions on your vision, and that if you could have the site not have any people while making your money, you would probably prefer that. :/ tl;dr: You really need to research marketing and learn how to communicate with your customers. Your tone deafness in this arena is costing you money. [/quote] Well, this is fairly thorough, definitely respectful, actually honest, and exactly how I feel about the situation. I have often decried the horrific state of communication between the staff and users. I hope the staff learns this from this whole crazy situation, even if they learn nothing else. Even if we have to put up with pupil-less female Bogsneaks, slit-pupiled (albeit multigazed) Mirrors, and Wind eyes that are more yellow than green. Staff, if you gain nothing else from this, please learn this. You invited us in. You asked us to stay. Some of us made a nice little space for ourselves here. It's [i]not[/i] weird that we expect some communication, and it [i]is[/i] weird that you should watch us set the metaphorical house on fire for three days before saying a word.

Now that I have arrived at the bargaining stage of grief, I am feeling like the natural eye options are a little too "random", so to speak, to feel like a natural thing that appears only via breeding dragons.

The different, more common tints are alright, but I think the three rarest types of eyes should all instead be variations of elemental magic manifesting in a dragon. Kinda like the dragon's power level. For example, first stage is simple glow in/around the dragons eye. Second stage has some small details around the dragon's eyes, like couple small flowers for nature, small embers for fire, bit of scarring for plague. Nothing too distracting, but a small fun detail. Then the last stage, the dragons born with highest levels of elemental magic inside them, should have the primal eyes we already have.
Makes it a little bit more logical, would fit lore better, doesn't feel quite as random as it is now. Could even make it so that two dragons with stage 1 elemental magic eyes would have a slightly better chance of producing hatchlings with stage 2 elemental magic eyes. So you could work towards the best eyes/your favourite eyes, even if it needs a bit of luck.

Faceted and multigaze I feel should be available by other means. Faceted looks like a gem thing, and there's already been suggestions that a notable mutation like multigaze should be Baldwin.

I know this isn't a perfect solution, just a thought I had. Feel free to comment and criticize :)